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Especially in English nowadays: Some people intentionally attempt to introduce more meaning into a phrase than is actually meant in general usage of the phrase,
by Fellshard 7y ago
Especially in English nowadays: Some people intentionally attempt to introduce more meaning into a phrase than is actually meant in general usage of the phrase, just so that they can be disruptive in this way. Others aren't attempting to be disruptive, but are misguidedly raising alarms thinking they are being helpful towards others, when in fact no-one is actually offended in the first place.
All this to say: you shouldn't have to worry about sensitivity for most of those kinds of phrases, except where someone is trying to make you say what you didn't want to say. Call it out when it happens and move on; don't apologize, and don't allow people to read malice into your intentions that you never had.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- peterwwillis 7y agoThis is just really bad career advice, but also you do see how your advice is logically problematic, right? In this model, nobody can ever have a valid complaint, if you never intend malice or offend an existing party. Example: If there are no black people in your office, and you use the N word a million times, and I complain, am I wrong to complain because there were no black people around to get offended or because you didn't intend malice? What's the point of caring whether someone uses a racial slur? Is it just because "that's what we're supposed to do" ? Or is there a deeper problem that we're trying to address?
- Fellshard 7y agoPerhaps I would have considered that more relevant a couple decades ago. In the context of the types of phrases being discussed in this thread, I'd err well on the side of assuming the speaker's intention is not malicious, unless a pattern of other kinds of similar phrases and ideas accompany it.
- cellularmitosis 7y agoMy dude, there is absolutely zero comparison to be drawn between using the phrase “hey you guys” and using the N word.
- peterwwillis 7y agoActually, my lady, there is a comparison, and it's the reason they are both wrong. Both are unacceptable because of the negative implications they have toward a gigantic group of people. With the N word, you're perpetuating a hurtful stereotype. With 'hey you guys', you're perpetuating a hurtful stereotype. The roots of both stereotypes are a form of supremacism where one group asserts its dominance on the other. The former is about racial dominance, the latter is about gender dominance. It's basically saying one group is more important than all the others, or one is inferior. That has real world effects and does really bother people. Maybe only one of them bothers you. That doesn't mean only one of them is valid. Logical deduction shows that they are both discrimination. It's up to you to decide what kind of discrimination you care about.
- cellularmitosis 7y agoI’m less bothered by the logic and more by the tone-deafness. If I am waging a campaign to end the tyranny of my office thermostat being set too cold, it would be in poor taste for me to draw a comparison between “my struggles” and the civil rights movement. It’s insulting to anyone involved with that movement.
- peterwwillis 7y agoI agree my comparison was a little extreme, I tend to do that sometimes. I'll work on toning that down.
- DiogenesKynikos 7y agoYou can't compare use of one of the most heavily laden racial slurs in the English language to use of a common 2nd-person plural pronoun like "you guys." There's a reasonability test here: if someone complains about the 2nd-person plural pronoun in one of the most widely spoken dialects of English, that's inherently less reasonable than complaining about use of a racial slur that's almost universally reviled. The latter is reasonable, but the former looks like moral crusading, perhaps even bullying.
- blaser-waffle 7y agoDo you see how your advice is logically problematic?