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I poked around on your blog for a bit, but couldn’t find any practical suggestions. How can a city-dweller with an oven, chest freezer, instant pot, and fridge

I poked around on your blog for a bit, but couldn’t find any practical suggestions. How can a city-dweller with an oven, chest freezer, instant pot, and fridge acquire meal without packaging and without 8 hours of administrative overhead per week?

dragontamer 7y ago
My opinion: just use steel cans. Steel has a 80%+ recycling rate, and even if thrown in the garbage... steel is one of the easiest materials to "mine" out of a garbage pit. Just shove everything into a blast furnace, and the things that don't burn is probably steel. Obviously a bit simplified: but that's the secret to glass, aluminum, and steel recycling. The high-temperature "purification" process of these materials makes for a very easy recycling process, even if there are contaminants in the material. In contrast, paper and plastic becomes useless due to contamination very easily. ------------- The amount of food available in steel cans is quite significant. Tuna, Salmon, Chicken, Peas, Carrots, Corn, Apricots, Peaches, Spinach, Pineapples, Beans, Potatoes, tomato paste... to name a few. Subsisting on canned food is boring, but doable. You've got meats, every major veggie, starches and fruits. Mix it up with some grains (ex: Rice, Flour), fresh starches (Potatoes keep well and don't really need to be in a can), fresh veggies (Onions keep well). --------- A combination of fresh fruits + cans manages to keep my trips to the grocery store down to once-per-week. Most fresh foods don't keep for a whole week (ex: Fresh Peppers, Fresh Basil, only stays good for a few days... while fresh ground beef / fresh chicken only stays for about 2 or 3 days). ---------- The counterargument to steel is that it is heavier than plastic. So it arguably takes more energy to ship steel cans than plastic containers. I haven't done the math however, but I assume steel is overall better for the environment.
- shiftpgdn 7y ago
  Steel cans have a plastic liner (acrylic and a polyester, usually.) Reusable glass with bottle deposit is probably the way to go.
  - dragontamer 7y ago
    The amount of plastic liner in steel cans is minuscule compared to plastic-packaging. And since its bonded to the Steel, you don't have to worry about disposal issues (ex: bags getting stuck in conveyor belts or whatever). > Reusable glass with bottle deposit is probably the way to go. I would bet that the lid on a glass bottle may have more plastic in it than a steel can, for example. But glass is definitely a highly-recyclable material. But you don't really find as much stuff in glass as in steel cans, and certainly not at the same prices. I can get 15oz of peas (or corn) in a steel can for roughly $0.70 for example. I don't think that sort of stuff comes that cheaply in glass containers.
spodek 7y ago
We learn through experience. I've found that when I answer what I did or offer suggestions, which I've done hundreds of times, the answer is almost always, "Oh, but that wouldn't work for me," followed by their reasons for keeping doing what they've been doing, with an air of "Ha, checkmate! Your special case doesn't apply to me." By contrast, when someone acts, they find answers for themselves. You described resources and constraints almost identical to mine except I didn't yet have a pressure cooker, which made everything easier. If you challenge yourself to go a week without food packaging, you won't die. You will figure out solutions that work for you. You will answer your question better than I could. In my case, I took about six months from conceiving that challenge to taking it on. I planned and analyzed but didn't actually act. When I acted, I did what I couldn't plan for lack of experience. Specifically I said I would buy no packaged food for a week but could finish what was in my cupboards. I made it 2.5 weeks. Now I find answers for new challenges everywhere because of my experience. If you take on the challenge, I'd love to hear how it goes. I believe you'll be amazed at what you can solve beyond your expectations.
- afarrell 7y ago
  I suspect if I took on the challenge, it would induce enough life-administrative stress that I would be at serious risk of losing my job and being kicked out of the country.
  - spodek 7y ago
    I felt that way too. Doing it changed everything. For example, I was pleasantly surprised to find cooking from scratch saved time and money and led to more social interactions. Now I often host heads of corporations for dinners, a Nobel Peace prize winner, etc. If you change your mind, let me know, though I probably won't find it in this thread. I'm easy enough to connect to from my web page, http://joshuaspodek.com http://joshuaspodek.com.
    - afarrell 7y ago
      > Now I often host heads of corporations for dinners, a Nobel Peace prize winner, etc Okay, if you have the social connections that you're hosting Nobel Peace Prize winners and heads of (implicit: larger than 200 employees) corporations for dinner, then there is definitely something you're not saying about the resources you have available to accomplish this. Like, I don't even know what country you live in. I don't know how far your house is from a grocery store. I don't know what percentage of the food in that grocery store is unpackaged. I don't know how many farmers/gardeners you have a relationship with. I don't know how much time you have to spend gardening. I don't know how bad of a headache your wife would have if dinner wasn't ready until 9:30pm. I don't know what ADHD medication you're trying to titrate. So all I have to go on are my circumstances. When I spend 30 seconds predicting what I'd have to do to "avoid all food which comes in a package", a list of like 10-20 problems comes to mind. Could I solve all of those problems? Probably. But in the 1.5 years it takes me to solve them, there is a good chance that I would be fired from my poor performance from my visa sponsoring job and get kicked out of the country. > By contrast, when someone acts, they find answers for themselves. Are you saying that you don't have any highly-distressing personal problems for which you've been seeking answers for half a decade?
megaremote 7y ago
Get rid of your car for starters. Shop at markets where they don't cover anything in plastic. Adjust what you eat around avoiding buying plastic, as much as you can.
- afarrell 7y ago
  I live close to central London. I don't have a car.
- Ancalagon 7y ago
  This is so far out of what I, a west-coast american, can actually accomplish its kind of funny. I know you are being serious and those are all great suggestions that I would love to implement, but to address them: things are so spread out here I literally can't get to work/a grocery store without a car, there's a single farmers market, which runs for 4 hours every Sunday once a week and doesnt cover everything in plastic. Its literally unobtainable for someone living here. Maybe directly inside the city its possible to go carless and shop only at farmers markets, but being downtown would be way too expensive.

dragontamer 7y ago

My opinion: just use steel cans. Steel has a 80%+ recycling rate, and even if thrown in the garbage... steel is one of the easiest materials to "mine" out of a garbage pit. Just shove everything into a blast furnace, and the things that don't burn is probably steel. Obviously a bit simplified: but that's the secret to glass, aluminum, and steel recycling. The high-temperature "purification" process of these materials makes for a very easy recycling process, even if there are contaminants in the material. In contrast, paper and plastic becomes useless due to contamination very easily. ------------- The amount of food available in steel cans is quite significant. Tuna, Salmon, Chicken, Peas, Carrots, Corn, Apricots, Peaches, Spinach, Pineapples, Beans, Potatoes, tomato paste... to name a few. Subsisting on canned food is boring, but doable. You've got meats, every major veggie, starches and fruits. Mix it up with some grains (ex: Rice, Flour), fresh starches (Potatoes keep well and don't really need to be in a can), fresh veggies (Onions keep well). --------- A combination of fresh fruits + cans manages to keep my trips to the grocery store down to once-per-week. Most fresh foods don't keep for a whole week (ex: Fresh Peppers, Fresh Basil, only stays good for a few days... while fresh ground beef / fresh chicken only stays for about 2 or 3 days). ---------- The counterargument to steel is that it is heavier than plastic. So it arguably takes more energy to ship steel cans than plastic containers. I haven't done the math however, but I assume steel is overall better for the environment.

shiftpgdn 7y ago
Steel cans have a plastic liner (acrylic and a polyester, usually.) Reusable glass with bottle deposit is probably the way to go.
- dragontamer 7y ago
  The amount of plastic liner in steel cans is minuscule compared to plastic-packaging. And since its bonded to the Steel, you don't have to worry about disposal issues (ex: bags getting stuck in conveyor belts or whatever). > Reusable glass with bottle deposit is probably the way to go. I would bet that the lid on a glass bottle may have more plastic in it than a steel can, for example. But glass is definitely a highly-recyclable material. But you don't really find as much stuff in glass as in steel cans, and certainly not at the same prices. I can get 15oz of peas (or corn) in a steel can for roughly $0.70 for example. I don't think that sort of stuff comes that cheaply in glass containers.

spodek 7y ago

We learn through experience. I've found that when I answer what I did or offer suggestions, which I've done hundreds of times, the answer is almost always, "Oh, but that wouldn't work for me," followed by their reasons for keeping doing what they've been doing, with an air of "Ha, checkmate! Your special case doesn't apply to me." By contrast, when someone acts, they find answers for themselves. You described resources and constraints almost identical to mine except I didn't yet have a pressure cooker, which made everything easier. If you challenge yourself to go a week without food packaging, you won't die. You will figure out solutions that work for you. You will answer your question better than I could. In my case, I took about six months from conceiving that challenge to taking it on. I planned and analyzed but didn't actually act. When I acted, I did what I couldn't plan for lack of experience. Specifically I said I would buy no packaged food for a week but could finish what was in my cupboards. I made it 2.5 weeks. Now I find answers for new challenges everywhere because of my experience. If you take on the challenge, I'd love to hear how it goes. I believe you'll be amazed at what you can solve beyond your expectations.

afarrell 7y ago
I suspect if I took on the challenge, it would induce enough life-administrative stress that I would be at serious risk of losing my job and being kicked out of the country.
- spodek 7y ago
  I felt that way too. Doing it changed everything. For example, I was pleasantly surprised to find cooking from scratch saved time and money and led to more social interactions. Now I often host heads of corporations for dinners, a Nobel Peace prize winner, etc. If you change your mind, let me know, though I probably won't find it in this thread. I'm easy enough to connect to from my web page, http://joshuaspodek.com http://joshuaspodek.com.
  - afarrell 7y ago
    > Now I often host heads of corporations for dinners, a Nobel Peace prize winner, etc Okay, if you have the social connections that you're hosting Nobel Peace Prize winners and heads of (implicit: larger than 200 employees) corporations for dinner, then there is definitely something you're not saying about the resources you have available to accomplish this. Like, I don't even know what country you live in. I don't know how far your house is from a grocery store. I don't know what percentage of the food in that grocery store is unpackaged. I don't know how many farmers/gardeners you have a relationship with. I don't know how much time you have to spend gardening. I don't know how bad of a headache your wife would have if dinner wasn't ready until 9:30pm. I don't know what ADHD medication you're trying to titrate. So all I have to go on are my circumstances. When I spend 30 seconds predicting what I'd have to do to "avoid all food which comes in a package", a list of like 10-20 problems comes to mind. Could I solve all of those problems? Probably. But in the 1.5 years it takes me to solve them, there is a good chance that I would be fired from my poor performance from my visa sponsoring job and get kicked out of the country. > By contrast, when someone acts, they find answers for themselves. Are you saying that you don't have any highly-distressing personal problems for which you've been seeking answers for half a decade?

megaremote 7y ago

Get rid of your car for starters. Shop at markets where they don't cover anything in plastic. Adjust what you eat around avoiding buying plastic, as much as you can.

afarrell 7y ago
I live close to central London. I don't have a car.
Ancalagon 7y ago
This is so far out of what I, a west-coast american, can actually accomplish its kind of funny. I know you are being serious and those are all great suggestions that I would love to implement, but to address them: things are so spread out here I literally can't get to work/a grocery store without a car, there's a single farmers market, which runs for 4 hours every Sunday once a week and doesnt cover everything in plastic. Its literally unobtainable for someone living here. Maybe directly inside the city its possible to go carless and shop only at farmers markets, but being downtown would be way too expensive.