4 ms·

We understand, it just annoys us.

by klochner 16y ago

locopati 16y ago
Thank you for a good laugh on a Friday afternoon in cubicle-land
Locke1689 16y ago
Why? Why do all companies have to operate the way you want them to and why do you have to buy their things?
- Locke1689 16y ago
  OK, to the two people who have downmodded my post, please clarify. This is a serious question: I don't understand why people who don't buy Apple products complain about Apple. It's not like they completely control the marketplace -- so what's the point (other than whining)?
  - glhaynes 16y ago
    I concur. If anything, they provide tremendous innovation that then can be copied in more open ways. If not for the iPhone, there's no way the rest of the cell phone marketplace would look like it does right now.
  - orangecat 16y ago
    It's not like they completely control the marketplace A year ago it was a real possibility that they would dominate mobile computing (soon to be just "computing"), and even today it's not out of the question if Android lawsuits go badly. I and plenty of others don't want to see a world where we're denied control of "our" hardware, and told we're criminals if we try to reclaim it.
    - bphogan 16y ago
      I was under the impression that, at least in the US, it was now legal to jailbreak your hardware. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ytech_wguy/ytech_wguy_tc3236 http://news.yahoo.com/s/ytech_wguy/ytech_wguy_tc3236 Did something change?
      - orangecat 16y ago
        It's not a DMCA violation, but it does violate the EULA, the legal ramifications of which are unclear. And of course it also voids your warranty.
  - cryptoz 16y ago
    I didn't vote you down, but I'll comment on the issue. First: > Why? Why do all companies have to operate the way you want them to and why do you have to buy their things? klochner never said companies "have" to operate a certain way. He just said that a company annoys him. That's all. He said nothing about how the company "should" or "must" operate. Just that the current model was annoying. Second: > I don't understand why people who don't buy Apple products complain about Apple. For the same reason that people who don't run Windows complain about Microsoft. Apple and Microsoft are defining forces in their industries. Even people who don't buy their products are massively affected by the actions of those companies. Examples: I don't own Windows or Office, so for years I could not reliably open .doc files. [1] Microsoft's proprietary file formats affect those who don't have enough money / don't wish to purchase their products. I don't own any iOS devices, but I am a software developer. If the future of computing moves to iPad-like devices (say, tablets, phones, whatever the future brings), Apple's closed model affects me greatly. I would be less capable of selling my own software due to their practices. Microsoft doesn't demand money from you if you want to develop for Windows. Apple does demand money from you if you want to develop for iOS (and seeing as iOS will soon - or already has - gained more users that OS X, I believe this is a fair comparison). This is not a good model for the future of computing, but it is the model Apple is using and they are a powerful force. So even though I do not own any Apple products, they are a dominating force in the industry and what they do matters to me. Edit: [1] I think that .doc is now an "open" standard, right? LibreOffice will probably eventually be fully compatible, but it's not ready yet.
    - bphogan 16y ago
      Microsoft doesn't charge you to develop for their PCs and neither does Apple. However, if you'd like to develop for the XBox or the Windows 7 phone, you are under almost the same terms as Apple. This is something Apple pioneered, and you can bet other companies are going to want a slice of that sweet sweet revenue pie.
      - cryptoz 16y ago
        > Microsoft doesn't charge you to develop for their PCs and neither does Apple. Yes I know, I tried to address that in my comment. I postulated that there are more iOS users than OS X users, just as there are more Windows users than XBox or WP7 users. For the purposes of my example, I picked the OS from each company with the greatest number of users. I definitely think my example is valid here, despite the differences between "PCs" and tablets, phones, whatever.
  - tdoggette 16y ago
    I want a nice, high-quality laptop or smartphone with hardware designed by the very best, and good production values from start to finish. I can't really get that from anyone but Apple. I've got a Thinkpad, but even that very nice machine is in a lower class of industrial design compared to Apple products. Likewise, my HTC Incredible is a great phone, but bits of it are clearly of lower quality than my friends' iPhone 4s. That's why some of Apple's practices annoy me-- because they're so damn good at everything else, they tempt me anyway.
  - klochner 16y ago
    I think you got downmodded for whining about other people whining - clearly you have no problem complaining about things you don't like, so let us do the same. FWIW, I buy and love apple products, I just like to tinker as well.
    - Locke1689 16y ago
      For the most part I only whine about things I use. I also don't expect people to take me seriously when I whine about the things I don't use. I obviously don't use it because it doesn't suit me, so why would I be a credible source for whining about it?
- danielsoneg 16y ago
  >Why do all companies have to operate the way you want them to[?] Obviously they don't, but I'd like them to. I've no right to tell you you have to save energy (for example), but I'd rather you did. Your right to do something is in no way impaired by my right to have an opinion about what you do, and vice versa. Nobody's saying Apple HAS to run a certain way, but boy would we prefer if they did a few things differently. > Why do you have to buy their things? I think the problem with Apple in particular is that they're Really, Really good. The products they put out are normally class-leading - I have a Droid, but the iPhone is just flat sexier. That said, I won't buy an iPhone, despite the fact that I think it's a really sexy, really well-made piece of hardware, because of certain policy and design decisions Apple made. I'm obviously not Apple's target demographic - my droid is rooted and I spend most of my day staring at a terminal window, so they're not going to do a whole lot to make my life easier, and I understand that, but it's still frustrating to see a drop-dead sexy piece of hardware that doesn't live up to what I see as it's potential. IOW: Sour Grapes.
  - Xuzz 16y ago
    (Somewhat unrelated, but: I'd never buy a Droid since Motorola refuses to allow me to install my own software, like a custom ROM.)

We understand, it just annoys us.

locopati 16y ago

Thank you for a good laugh on a Friday afternoon in cubicle-land

Locke1689 16y ago

Why? Why do all companies have to operate the way you want them to and why do you have to buy their things?

Locke1689 16y ago
OK, to the two people who have downmodded my post, please clarify. This is a serious question: I don't understand why people who don't buy Apple products complain about Apple. It's not like they completely control the marketplace -- so what's the point (other than whining)?
- glhaynes 16y ago
  I concur. If anything, they provide tremendous innovation that then can be copied in more open ways. If not for the iPhone, there's no way the rest of the cell phone marketplace would look like it does right now.
- orangecat 16y ago
  It's not like they completely control the marketplace A year ago it was a real possibility that they would dominate mobile computing (soon to be just "computing"), and even today it's not out of the question if Android lawsuits go badly. I and plenty of others don't want to see a world where we're denied control of "our" hardware, and told we're criminals if we try to reclaim it.
  - bphogan 16y ago
    I was under the impression that, at least in the US, it was now legal to jailbreak your hardware. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ytech_wguy/ytech_wguy_tc3236 http://news.yahoo.com/s/ytech_wguy/ytech_wguy_tc3236 Did something change?
    - orangecat 16y ago
      It's not a DMCA violation, but it does violate the EULA, the legal ramifications of which are unclear. And of course it also voids your warranty.
- cryptoz 16y ago
  I didn't vote you down, but I'll comment on the issue. First: > Why? Why do all companies have to operate the way you want them to and why do you have to buy their things? klochner never said companies "have" to operate a certain way. He just said that a company annoys him. That's all. He said nothing about how the company "should" or "must" operate. Just that the current model was annoying. Second: > I don't understand why people who don't buy Apple products complain about Apple. For the same reason that people who don't run Windows complain about Microsoft. Apple and Microsoft are defining forces in their industries. Even people who don't buy their products are massively affected by the actions of those companies. Examples: I don't own Windows or Office, so for years I could not reliably open .doc files. [1] Microsoft's proprietary file formats affect those who don't have enough money / don't wish to purchase their products. I don't own any iOS devices, but I am a software developer. If the future of computing moves to iPad-like devices (say, tablets, phones, whatever the future brings), Apple's closed model affects me greatly. I would be less capable of selling my own software due to their practices. Microsoft doesn't demand money from you if you want to develop for Windows. Apple does demand money from you if you want to develop for iOS (and seeing as iOS will soon - or already has - gained more users that OS X, I believe this is a fair comparison). This is not a good model for the future of computing, but it is the model Apple is using and they are a powerful force. So even though I do not own any Apple products, they are a dominating force in the industry and what they do matters to me. Edit: [1] I think that .doc is now an "open" standard, right? LibreOffice will probably eventually be fully compatible, but it's not ready yet.
  - bphogan 16y ago
    Microsoft doesn't charge you to develop for their PCs and neither does Apple. However, if you'd like to develop for the XBox or the Windows 7 phone, you are under almost the same terms as Apple. This is something Apple pioneered, and you can bet other companies are going to want a slice of that sweet sweet revenue pie.
    - cryptoz 16y ago
      > Microsoft doesn't charge you to develop for their PCs and neither does Apple. Yes I know, I tried to address that in my comment. I postulated that there are more iOS users than OS X users, just as there are more Windows users than XBox or WP7 users. For the purposes of my example, I picked the OS from each company with the greatest number of users. I definitely think my example is valid here, despite the differences between "PCs" and tablets, phones, whatever.
- tdoggette 16y ago
  I want a nice, high-quality laptop or smartphone with hardware designed by the very best, and good production values from start to finish. I can't really get that from anyone but Apple. I've got a Thinkpad, but even that very nice machine is in a lower class of industrial design compared to Apple products. Likewise, my HTC Incredible is a great phone, but bits of it are clearly of lower quality than my friends' iPhone 4s. That's why some of Apple's practices annoy me-- because they're so damn good at everything else, they tempt me anyway.
- klochner 16y ago
  I think you got downmodded for whining about other people whining - clearly you have no problem complaining about things you don't like, so let us do the same. FWIW, I buy and love apple products, I just like to tinker as well.
  - Locke1689 16y ago
    For the most part I only whine about things I use. I also don't expect people to take me seriously when I whine about the things I don't use. I obviously don't use it because it doesn't suit me, so why would I be a credible source for whining about it?
danielsoneg 16y ago
>Why do all companies have to operate the way you want them to[?] Obviously they don't, but I'd like them to. I've no right to tell you you have to save energy (for example), but I'd rather you did. Your right to do something is in no way impaired by my right to have an opinion about what you do, and vice versa. Nobody's saying Apple HAS to run a certain way, but boy would we prefer if they did a few things differently. > Why do you have to buy their things? I think the problem with Apple in particular is that they're Really, Really good. The products they put out are normally class-leading - I have a Droid, but the iPhone is just flat sexier. That said, I won't buy an iPhone, despite the fact that I think it's a really sexy, really well-made piece of hardware, because of certain policy and design decisions Apple made. I'm obviously not Apple's target demographic - my droid is rooted and I spend most of my day staring at a terminal window, so they're not going to do a whole lot to make my life easier, and I understand that, but it's still frustrating to see a drop-dead sexy piece of hardware that doesn't live up to what I see as it's potential. IOW: Sour Grapes.
- Xuzz 16y ago
  (Somewhat unrelated, but: I'd never buy a Droid since Motorola refuses to allow me to install my own software, like a custom ROM.)