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Has anyone read the pull request? For those that didn't, here it is: + We do business with customers with values that are incompatible with [our own values](
by peterwwillis 7y ago
Has anyone read the pull request? For those that didn't, here it is:
+ We do business with customers with values that are incompatible with [our own values](/handbook/values/) for the following reasons:
+
+ 1. Our mission is 'everyone can contribute', while there is a [code of conduct for contributing](https://about.gitlab.com/community/contribute/code-of-conduct/) we want to get as close to everyone as possible.
+ 1. We [do not discuss politics in the workplace](/handbook/values/#religion-and-politics-at-work-) and decisions about what customer to serve might get political.
+ 1. [Efficiency is one of our values](/handbook/values/#efficiency) and vetting customers is time consuming and potentially distracting.
+ 1. It maps to the MIT expat open source license we use that [doesn't discriminate against fields of endeavor](https://apebox.org/wordpress/rants/456).
Of the "we do not discuss politics in the workplace", this is the quote from the handbook:
We generally don't discuss religion or politics in public forums because it is easy to alienate people
that have a minority opinion. It's acceptable to bring up these topics in social contexts such as
coffee chats and real-life meetups with other coworkers, but always be aware of cultural sensitivities,
exercise your best judgement, and make sure you stay within the boundaries of our Code of Conduct.
Here's the problem: this policy can be used to protect people, and disenfranchise people.
On the one hand, you can use this policy to prevent white people from loudly supporting a white supremacist political leader in an office with a very small percentage of people of color. Banning talk of politics here will make it easier to stop dog-whistle racism before it even starts.
On the other hand, you can also use this policy to shut conversations by minority groups who want to support politicians who are improving the lives of people of color. If one goal your company has is, for example, to make your company more ethnically diverse, it would perhaps behoove you to allow different ethnic groups to discuss the political issues they face, and raise awareness of issues critical to them. Banning such speech makes it much harder for them to advocate for better treatment, and educate people in the workplace about the issues they face.
Everyone who thinks this is controversial is falling into the trap of trying to judge a complex issue with emotion, rather than complex rational thought. If you literally decided your opinion about this within 30 seconds, chances are it wasn't very well thought out. I'm willing to bet the CEO is just as guilty of such rushed decision-making.
--
But there were three other points in the PR!! The last of which I think is really worth considering: "The MIT expat open source license [..] doesn't discriminate against fields of endeavor."
The most common example given is that "you cannot stop an abortion clinic, or an anti-abortion activist, from using the source code". This is an incredibly important part of our society that protects minority groups.
In 2012, in Colorado, a bakery discriminated against a gay couple by refusing to make their wedding cake, because the bakery owners didn't approve of gay marriage. This was (rightly, I think) found by the courts to be illegal discrimination. But you could also consider this case a form of discrimination of field of endeavor, if what you're endeavoring-for is to be married while gay. You can't refuse to make the gay couple a wedding cake - so should you be able to refuse a white supremacist from using your version control tool?
This is where we walk into ethical quicksand. There is a l o n g philosophical rabbit hole you can fall down trying to figure out how to treat people you disagree with. People have spent their whole lives going over these issues and literally nobody has figured it out for certain. And that's why I think the policy, based on the third reason, is acceptable.
The third reasoning, "vetting customers is time consuming and potentially distracting", is clearly true. We could spend our entire lives arguing the moral philosophy of how to treat people we disagree with, but we'd never get any work done. Sure, you could start an ongoing process of defining who can and can't be a customer, but if it takes any amount of discussion at all, and impacts your business, you're losing money and time, and not necessarily achieving an increase in value, either for society, or your customers/stockholders.
So for the sake of expediency, for simplicity, for being the Switzerland of open source, this one company can allow that particular conversation to go on outside its walls, and continue to just bake cakes and write version control tools, and let history be the ultimate arbiter.
- DATACOMMANDER 7y agoWhat part of the world do you live in, where there’s a real risk of a white supremacist politician receiving even 1% of 1% of the popular vote?
- peterwwillis 7y agoThe USA. We've had white supremacist politicians for hundreds of years, and in many parts of the us they carry more than 10% of the vote. As recently as 2016, the former head of the Ku Klux Klan received 3% of election day votes (58,000 people) for a United States Senate seat for the state of Louisiana. Here's an article from 2018, "All The White Supremacists Running For Office": https://www.huffpost.com/entry/white-supremacists-running-for-office-2018_n_5a7da926e4b0c6726e1285c1 https://www.huffpost.com/entry/white-supremacists-running-fo... There are 12 candidates listed. Here's a white supremacist running unopposed for Congress in 2018: https://www.npr.org/2018/02/08/583993705/a-white-supremacist-may-be-the-only-republican-running-for-a-seat-in-congress https://www.npr.org/2018/02/08/583993705/a-white-supremacist... In Germany there has recently been an alarming rise in white nationalist political sentiment in large swaths of the country. Here's a list of European white supremacy groups: https://www.counterextremism.com/european-white-supremacy-groups https://www.counterextremism.com/european-white-supremacy-gr...
- DATACOMMANDER 7y agoI should have been more specific: I was referring to elections for head of state. Regardless, your post is high on rhetoric and low on content. You provide no citation for your strongest claim (that in many part of the US white supremacists carry more than 10% of the vote for some office or another). The white supremacist whom you claim is running for Congress “unopposed” will certainly be opposed by a Democrat, and will certainly lose. If only 12 white supremacists ran for office in 2018, that runs counter to the notion that white supremacists are a significant force in American politics. Almost anyone can run for office, and I highly doubt that any of them won anyway. Given the number of elected officials in the US, I think it’s fair to say that any group that doesn’t hold at least one office is not a significant political force. Can you name an elected official who is a white supremacist? (Before you accuse me of shifting the goalposts: I wasn’t clear in my original post. If you can find a presidential election that occurred in the last 20 years in which a white supremacist received more than 0.01% of the popular vote, I’ll stand corrected. You’ll have to go back farther than 2016: I googled every candidate [1] who received more than 0.01% of the popular vote in 2016 and none of them is a white supremacist.) 1. https://transition.fec.gov/pubrec/fe2016/2016presgeresults.pdf https://transition.fec.gov/pubrec/fe2016/2016presgeresults.p...