6 ms·

"Some even had tomatoes on top. Only recently introduced from the Americas, these were still a curiosity, looked down upon by contemporary gourmets". Well that

"Some even had tomatoes on top. Only recently introduced from the Americas, these were still a curiosity, looked down upon by contemporary gourmets". Well that settles it. Next time a pizza traditionalist blasts me for having pineapple on my pizza, I'll counter that he shouldn't have tomatoes on theirs.

SideburnsOfDoom 7y ago
And the use of tomato paste or sauce underneath, rather than sliced tomato on top, seems to be an even later innovation.
- dotancohen 7y ago
  This was done not for the taste, but so that the pizza could be prepared in advance of being served. The idea was that the tomato paste would not go bad or seep juices into the dough base. Its is actually a regression from a culinary standpoint.
  - mattmar96 7y ago
    I disagree. Pizza sauce means more oppurtunity for culinary expression. Dont get me wrong, margherita is great, but to say pizza sauce is a regression is a bit silly IMO
  - SamBam 7y ago
    That's like saying pickles and preserves and fermented foods are a "culinary regression" because they were created to prevent fresh food from going bad. Something can be both practical and not a "regression."
NCG_Mike 7y ago
There's a kind of pizza that I've had at a Turkish restaurant that comes without tomatoes. Really nice. I'd assume a common origin with the Italian variety via the Romans (ancient).
- SideburnsOfDoom 7y ago
  Many varieties of Italian pizza are "white pizza" / "pizza blanca" and have no tomatoes.
  - manojlds 7y ago
    Like pesto ones too right.
    - zeitg3ist 7y ago
      As an Italian (not from Genoa though), pesto to me has always been just a pasta sauce, so I was very surprised to see it used on salads and pizzas abroad. But recently (in the last 2-3 years) I’ve seen quite a few Italian pizzerias (not the most traditional, of course) starting to use it as an alternative choice to the tomato sauce, or, sometimes, in place of the olive oil on top. Not sure if it’s a regional variation gone national or an influence from abroad... but if it’s the latter, no Italian would ever admit that :)
    - SamBam 7y ago
      Pesto is very rare on pizzas in Italy, as is chicken and many of the other things that are found in the US. (It's not bad, it's just that if you were looking for tomato-less pizza in Italy, you wouldn't find pesto.)
- clan 7y ago
  Yes! It is called "pide". Wikipedia relates it to the pita - but I would describe it closer to as pizza as well. I find them in Turkish restaurants around here as well. They often look like this: http://loveantalya.com/turkish-pide-with-meat-filling-cheese-and-sucuk/ http://loveantalya.com/turkish-pide-with-meat-filling-cheese... Pizza-like but not pizza. I love them for what they are. But again I love any kind of pizza (Naples, Chicago, thin, thick, doughy etc.)
- ReptileMan 7y ago
  This is either lahmadjun or pide. They are close, but don't seem to have common origins, just independent discoveries. Same as flatbreads. And putting some topping on one is hardly a world shattering idea.
benj111 7y ago
When you say "pizza traditionalist" you seem to mean 'someone with functioning tastebuds'. :)
- ryanlol 7y ago
  Why is it always pineapple in pizza? Why not lemon for example? I don’t understand the whole pineapple pizza lobby, it’s just not a particularly good fruit for pizza.
  - C1sc0cat 7y ago
    The contrasting taste of Pineapple and Ham does work well in my opinion.
    - ryanlol 7y ago
      Have you tried lemon (somewhat caramelized) and ham? :P
  - soperj 7y ago
    I've done mango, and it's pretty good. I could see lemon being nice. Dried Fig is also great on pizza.
  - 98codes 7y ago
    It's a question of ingredient quality. Most Hawaiian pizza is made with canned pineapple and thick-cut deli ham. Fresh pineapple and also any other pork aside from that ham is a big, big upgrade.
    - Terr_ 7y ago
      Yeah, that may have something to do with Hawaii as an island location, and what can easily be preserved, shipped, and stockpiled.
  - ofrzeta 7y ago
    Though not strictly pizza Chris Bianco has lemon, rosemary and pecorino focaccia in his cookbook https://www.bakingsteel.com/blog/lemon-and-rosemary-focaccia https://www.bakingsteel.com/blog/lemon-and-rosemary-focaccia
grumpydba 7y ago
> Well that settles it. Next time a pizza traditionalist blasts me for having pineapple on my pizza, I'll counter that he shouldn't have tomatoes on theirs. I don't think it's a matter of tradition. It's a matter of taste.
jgwil2 7y ago
Have whatever pleases you, but for the life of me I will never understand corn on pizza.

SideburnsOfDoom 7y ago

And the use of tomato paste or sauce underneath, rather than sliced tomato on top, seems to be an even later innovation.

dotancohen 7y ago
This was done not for the taste, but so that the pizza could be prepared in advance of being served. The idea was that the tomato paste would not go bad or seep juices into the dough base. Its is actually a regression from a culinary standpoint.
- mattmar96 7y ago
  I disagree. Pizza sauce means more oppurtunity for culinary expression. Dont get me wrong, margherita is great, but to say pizza sauce is a regression is a bit silly IMO
- SamBam 7y ago
  That's like saying pickles and preserves and fermented foods are a "culinary regression" because they were created to prevent fresh food from going bad. Something can be both practical and not a "regression."

NCG_Mike 7y ago

There's a kind of pizza that I've had at a Turkish restaurant that comes without tomatoes. Really nice. I'd assume a common origin with the Italian variety via the Romans (ancient).

SideburnsOfDoom 7y ago
Many varieties of Italian pizza are "white pizza" / "pizza blanca" and have no tomatoes.
- manojlds 7y ago
  Like pesto ones too right.
  - zeitg3ist 7y ago
    As an Italian (not from Genoa though), pesto to me has always been just a pasta sauce, so I was very surprised to see it used on salads and pizzas abroad. But recently (in the last 2-3 years) I’ve seen quite a few Italian pizzerias (not the most traditional, of course) starting to use it as an alternative choice to the tomato sauce, or, sometimes, in place of the olive oil on top. Not sure if it’s a regional variation gone national or an influence from abroad... but if it’s the latter, no Italian would ever admit that :)
  - SamBam 7y ago
    Pesto is very rare on pizzas in Italy, as is chicken and many of the other things that are found in the US. (It's not bad, it's just that if you were looking for tomato-less pizza in Italy, you wouldn't find pesto.)
clan 7y ago
Yes! It is called "pide". Wikipedia relates it to the pita - but I would describe it closer to as pizza as well. I find them in Turkish restaurants around here as well. They often look like this: http://loveantalya.com/turkish-pide-with-meat-filling-cheese-and-sucuk/ http://loveantalya.com/turkish-pide-with-meat-filling-cheese... Pizza-like but not pizza. I love them for what they are. But again I love any kind of pizza (Naples, Chicago, thin, thick, doughy etc.)
ReptileMan 7y ago
This is either lahmadjun or pide. They are close, but don't seem to have common origins, just independent discoveries. Same as flatbreads. And putting some topping on one is hardly a world shattering idea.

benj111 7y ago

When you say "pizza traditionalist" you seem to mean 'someone with functioning tastebuds'. :)

ryanlol 7y ago
Why is it always pineapple in pizza? Why not lemon for example? I don’t understand the whole pineapple pizza lobby, it’s just not a particularly good fruit for pizza.
- C1sc0cat 7y ago
  The contrasting taste of Pineapple and Ham does work well in my opinion.
  - ryanlol 7y ago
    Have you tried lemon (somewhat caramelized) and ham? :P
- soperj 7y ago
  I've done mango, and it's pretty good. I could see lemon being nice. Dried Fig is also great on pizza.
- 98codes 7y ago
  It's a question of ingredient quality. Most Hawaiian pizza is made with canned pineapple and thick-cut deli ham. Fresh pineapple and also any other pork aside from that ham is a big, big upgrade.
  - Terr_ 7y ago
    Yeah, that may have something to do with Hawaii as an island location, and what can easily be preserved, shipped, and stockpiled.
- ofrzeta 7y ago
  Though not strictly pizza Chris Bianco has lemon, rosemary and pecorino focaccia in his cookbook https://www.bakingsteel.com/blog/lemon-and-rosemary-focaccia https://www.bakingsteel.com/blog/lemon-and-rosemary-focaccia

grumpydba 7y ago

> Well that settles it. Next time a pizza traditionalist blasts me for having pineapple on my pizza, I'll counter that he shouldn't have tomatoes on theirs. I don't think it's a matter of tradition. It's a matter of taste.

jgwil2 7y ago

Have whatever pleases you, but for the life of me I will never understand corn on pizza.