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Someone else already replied with links so I'm not going to rehash here, but your parent post was the very definition of anecdote. You tried to refute entire st

Someone else already replied with links so I'm not going to rehash here, but your parent post was the very definition of anecdote. You tried to refute entire studies and the current scientific consensus with a single example of how your kids do great academically despite waking up early for school. That is literally what an anecdote is.

ThomPete 7y ago
Here is exactly what I wrote: , my two sons are top performers in their school and the school network is top 3% performing in NY state. I wasn't just talking about my two sons but about the school network in New York state. That's not anecdotal what so ever. Here are the actual results from Success Academy: https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/more-on-the-phenomenal-eye-popping-success-of-success-academy-charter-schools-in-nyc/ https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/more-on-the-phenomenal-eye-po... How is that anecdotal?
- boomboomsubban 7y ago
  "This one school performs well and it has a start time before 8" is anecdotal evidence. Only one school's performance or start time is considered.
  - ThomPete 7y ago
    Not single school, school network! I don't know how more clear I can be.
    - boomboomsubban 7y ago
      "This one school network..." doesn't stop it from being an anecdote.
      - ThomPete 7y ago
        It does when it results are compared to the entire new york state and its consistently in the top.
        jameshart 7y ago
        What’s your control? Do other schools in or out of the top 3% have earlier or later start times? How do you account for confounds like socioeconomics and demographics? If you don’t, what you have is an anecdote, not evidence. Others are pointing you to studies that look at real data and apply statistical rigor. You are arguing that your knowledge of a single example outweighs that evidence. That is precisely what people mean when they accuse you of using ‘anecdata’.
        ThomPete 7y ago
        17.3% of schools in New York start later than 8.30, the majority starts between 8-8.30 SA starts at 7.45 yet they dominate the Top 30 out of a sample of 2400 schools. I can live with that as a significant sample size and control group ESPECIALLY since I never said that the earlier you are up the better but simply that it's not a problem if you get early enough to sleep. The study you refer to compares 2, TWO schools and doesn't come to any conclusion that contradicts mine in fact it support it. More sleep means better performance most of all. But sure keep on claiming I am the one who is making anecdotal claims.
        boomboomsubban 7y ago
        >But sure keep on claiming I am the one who is making anecdotal claims You are. This doesn't mean they are for sure wrong, but you are looking at the success of one school system and saying that means that the start time does not matter. For all you know, that school system could change to starting at 8:30 and rank even higher. It is a textbook anecdotal claim. >The study you refer to compares 2, TWO schools and doesn't come to any conclusion that contradicts mine in fact it support it. More sleep means better performance most of all. That study doesn't compare two schools, it compares two classes in both of the schools against each other. This let's them better isolate the start time as the variable responsible for the change. It also references other studies with similar results. And it does disagree with you, the later start time was associated with kids getting 30 more minutes of sleep.

ThomPete 7y ago

Here is exactly what I wrote: , my two sons are top performers in their school and the school network is top 3% performing in NY state. I wasn't just talking about my two sons but about the school network in New York state. That's not anecdotal what so ever. Here are the actual results from Success Academy: https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/more-on-the-phenomenal-eye-popping-success-of-success-academy-charter-schools-in-nyc/ https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/more-on-the-phenomenal-eye-po... How is that anecdotal?

boomboomsubban 7y ago
"This one school performs well and it has a start time before 8" is anecdotal evidence. Only one school's performance or start time is considered.
- ThomPete 7y ago
  Not single school, school network! I don't know how more clear I can be.
  - boomboomsubban 7y ago
    "This one school network..." doesn't stop it from being an anecdote.
    - ThomPete 7y ago
      It does when it results are compared to the entire new york state and its consistently in the top.
      - jameshart 7y ago
        What’s your control? Do other schools in or out of the top 3% have earlier or later start times? How do you account for confounds like socioeconomics and demographics? If you don’t, what you have is an anecdote, not evidence. Others are pointing you to studies that look at real data and apply statistical rigor. You are arguing that your knowledge of a single example outweighs that evidence. That is precisely what people mean when they accuse you of using ‘anecdata’.
        ThomPete 7y ago
        17.3% of schools in New York start later than 8.30, the majority starts between 8-8.30 SA starts at 7.45 yet they dominate the Top 30 out of a sample of 2400 schools. I can live with that as a significant sample size and control group ESPECIALLY since I never said that the earlier you are up the better but simply that it's not a problem if you get early enough to sleep. The study you refer to compares 2, TWO schools and doesn't come to any conclusion that contradicts mine in fact it support it. More sleep means better performance most of all. But sure keep on claiming I am the one who is making anecdotal claims.
        boomboomsubban 7y ago
        >But sure keep on claiming I am the one who is making anecdotal claims You are. This doesn't mean they are for sure wrong, but you are looking at the success of one school system and saying that means that the start time does not matter. For all you know, that school system could change to starting at 8:30 and rank even higher. It is a textbook anecdotal claim. >The study you refer to compares 2, TWO schools and doesn't come to any conclusion that contradicts mine in fact it support it. More sleep means better performance most of all. That study doesn't compare two schools, it compares two classes in both of the schools against each other. This let's them better isolate the start time as the variable responsible for the change. It also references other studies with similar results. And it does disagree with you, the later start time was associated with kids getting 30 more minutes of sleep.