4 ms·

> Sometimes, "what was happening before but faster" alone is what can cause something to cross the line of legality (philosophically.) Not that I don't believe

> Sometimes, "what was happening before but faster" alone is what can cause something to cross the line of legality (philosophically.) Not that I don't believe you, but I can't think of any examples off of the top of my head. Can you give me one?

nerdponx 7y ago
It used to be expensive (in both time and money) to track people's movements. Now cell phone carriers (as well as Google, Apple, and a few other companies) can do it trivially.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
rhcom2 7y ago
Automated license plate readers spring to mind. The police have been noting license plates forever, automate it and suddenly now you have a database that tracks everyone's movements.
curryst 7y ago
One that comes to mind is the Supreme Court enforced ban on creating a firearms registry. Firearms dealers are required to retain sales records with serial numbers for some amount of time (I don't have the number handy, it's several years) so technically the data exists currently. However they have ruled that it would be illegal to centralize that data for easier access. Another is those automated speeding cameras. In several states they are unable to write tickets without a police officer present. My understanding is that this means the machine operates the same way and still writes tickets, the officer just has to be there as a "witness" and play phone games or whatever while the machine works. The end effect is the same, but the law requires an officer to be a witness to the crime in order to generate tickets.
- enjo 7y ago
  Medical Marijuana states often have similar laws. A registry of people with medical access exists, but it becomes illegal to exfiltrate the data for any reason (the registry is often on one computer in a state house office somewhere).
- snagglegaggle 7y ago
  W.r.t. the firearms registry, there does appear to be one. FFLs reported targeted and widespread harassment by the ATF as they came in and digitized purchase records onsite 2010ish to 2016ish. Some FFL holders had to threaten force to prevent the records from being removed from their premesis. So who know what other methods are used for parallel construction.
- Animats 7y ago
  One that comes to mind is the Supreme Court enforced ban on creating a firearms registry. No, that's not the Supreme Court. That's the Firearms Owner Protection Act of 1986.[1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act
  - curryst 7y ago
    I stand corrected, thanks!
grawprog 7y ago
To be extremely literal about it. Everyone's slowly dying every day, but if you go and speed that up and kill somebody, it becomes really illegal.
torstenvl 7y ago
Cell site location information was deemed a search based on the fact that it is "detailed, encyclopedic, and effortlessly compiled." The speed with which law enforcement can track you with CSLI, compared to canvassing witnesses, is the key factor.
munificent 7y ago
Semi-automatic firearms versus fully automatic. It's legal to own a personal killing machine, as long as it can't kill above a certain rate.
pyrale 7y ago
Asymetric crypto is all about this. The only difference between the key holder and a third party is a time factor. Another exemple is the rationale for EU privacy laws. It was fine to have your history in newspapers or judicial archives, as searching for them was prohibitive. But having it searchable through computers makes it trivial for would-be employers, neighbours, etc. to find out about you, transforming any small misdemeanour in a lifetime sentence.

nerdponx 7y ago

It used to be expensive (in both time and money) to track people's movements. Now cell phone carriers (as well as Google, Apple, and a few other companies) can do it trivially.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

rhcom2 7y ago

Automated license plate readers spring to mind. The police have been noting license plates forever, automate it and suddenly now you have a database that tracks everyone's movements.

curryst 7y ago

One that comes to mind is the Supreme Court enforced ban on creating a firearms registry. Firearms dealers are required to retain sales records with serial numbers for some amount of time (I don't have the number handy, it's several years) so technically the data exists currently. However they have ruled that it would be illegal to centralize that data for easier access. Another is those automated speeding cameras. In several states they are unable to write tickets without a police officer present. My understanding is that this means the machine operates the same way and still writes tickets, the officer just has to be there as a "witness" and play phone games or whatever while the machine works. The end effect is the same, but the law requires an officer to be a witness to the crime in order to generate tickets.

enjo 7y ago
Medical Marijuana states often have similar laws. A registry of people with medical access exists, but it becomes illegal to exfiltrate the data for any reason (the registry is often on one computer in a state house office somewhere).
snagglegaggle 7y ago
W.r.t. the firearms registry, there does appear to be one. FFLs reported targeted and widespread harassment by the ATF as they came in and digitized purchase records onsite 2010ish to 2016ish. Some FFL holders had to threaten force to prevent the records from being removed from their premesis. So who know what other methods are used for parallel construction.
Animats 7y ago
One that comes to mind is the Supreme Court enforced ban on creating a firearms registry. No, that's not the Supreme Court. That's the Firearms Owner Protection Act of 1986.[1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act
- curryst 7y ago
  I stand corrected, thanks!

grawprog 7y ago

To be extremely literal about it. Everyone's slowly dying every day, but if you go and speed that up and kill somebody, it becomes really illegal.

torstenvl 7y ago

Cell site location information was deemed a search based on the fact that it is "detailed, encyclopedic, and effortlessly compiled." The speed with which law enforcement can track you with CSLI, compared to canvassing witnesses, is the key factor.

munificent 7y ago

Semi-automatic firearms versus fully automatic. It's legal to own a personal killing machine, as long as it can't kill above a certain rate.

pyrale 7y ago

Asymetric crypto is all about this. The only difference between the key holder and a third party is a time factor. Another exemple is the rationale for EU privacy laws. It was fine to have your history in newspapers or judicial archives, as searching for them was prohibitive. But having it searchable through computers makes it trivial for would-be employers, neighbours, etc. to find out about you, transforming any small misdemeanour in a lifetime sentence.