4 ms·

Are there really that many empty apartments? I am sure they exist, but are there really enough of them to make a dent in the market? Having lived in the city fo

by vobios 7y ago

Are there really that many empty apartments? I am sure they exist, but are there really enough of them to make a dent in the market? Having lived in the city for years, I've never actually seen one. I also wonder if you have enough cash to buy and hold NYC apartments, wouldn't your money do better in some sort of a REIT?

timidiceball 7y ago
It’s a problem at the high end (which is most of what’s been built lately) https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/13/realestate/new-development-new-york.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/13/realestate/new-developmen...
- vobios 7y ago
  Does the data presented in that article really suggest that the apartments are actually empty or is it simply that it takes a while to sell out a new development? It's going to take a while to move a hundred units, especially if you want to increase the profits. The StreetEasy report the article is inspired by actually shows that in 2019 there were more condos sold than completed.
corporateslave5 7y ago
Where do you put 1 trillion dollars when your main goal is to just preserve it or lose just a little?
- vobios 7y ago
  > just preserve it or lose just a little Housing generally underperforms the overall market.
  - codingslave 7y ago
    Yeah but you cant jam 1 trillion into any asset vehicle at all, and even if you could, you need to diversify. Portfolio theory 101
  - cko 7y ago
    Which market? https://www.frbsf.org/economic-research/files/wp2017-25.pdf https://www.frbsf.org/economic-research/files/wp2017-25.pdf
- imgabe 7y ago
  The only people with that problem are running sovereign wealth funds. IMO that should be invested in the infrastructure and social services of your nation to create a more educated and productive populace which will return the investment in the form of taxes.
CoolGuySteve 7y ago
If you look at the new residential sky scrapers like 432 Park around 10pm on a weeknight when most people should be home, you'll notice it's mostly dark. These tall expensive condo towers are like totems to the wealthy absentee residents of New York.
- goldenkey 7y ago
  You might enjoy this series: https://youtu.be/-55jtMMLJxk https://youtu.be/-55jtMMLJxk
- bilbo0s 7y ago
  Well maybe that's a bit of the problem. People are saying they can't get an apartment in NYC. Which is met by disbelief by people who actually live in NYC. I believe this might be due to the fact that people are really saying that they want a, say, lower Manhattan apartment but can't afford the good ones anywhere. These are probably upper middle class people trying to live a bit outside their means. It's not really that they can't afford NYC, they just don't want to live in Harlem. Or even in Brooklyn, which actually has pretty nice apartments. When I look around Harlem or the Bronx, I don't think, "empty". Not being able to live where the rich people live is not a problem that society should spend much time solving. I'm one of the very comfortable upper middle class. Yet I don't have a Ferrari, nor do I own a condo on Miami Beach. (Or Manhattan for that matter.) That doesn't mean that society has some sort of housing and car imbalance that it needs to address. There may indeed be an imbalance nationally, but NYC is definitely not any kind of example of one.
  - bobbydroptables 7y ago
    NYC is definitely an example of a housing imbalance. It has nothing to do with UMC types not wanting to live in Harlem. It has to do with the fact that prices are ridiculous throughout the city. The quality of building you get for what you pay is way out of whack. The housing stock is old and generally low quality.
    - lotsofpulp 7y ago

by vobios 7y ago

timidiceball 7y ago

It’s a problem at the high end (which is most of what’s been built lately) https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/13/realestate/new-development-new-york.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/13/realestate/new-developmen...

vobios 7y ago
Does the data presented in that article really suggest that the apartments are actually empty or is it simply that it takes a while to sell out a new development? It's going to take a while to move a hundred units, especially if you want to increase the profits. The StreetEasy report the article is inspired by actually shows that in 2019 there were more condos sold than completed.

corporateslave5 7y ago

Where do you put 1 trillion dollars when your main goal is to just preserve it or lose just a little?

vobios 7y ago
> just preserve it or lose just a little Housing generally underperforms the overall market.
- codingslave 7y ago
  Yeah but you cant jam 1 trillion into any asset vehicle at all, and even if you could, you need to diversify. Portfolio theory 101
- cko 7y ago
  Which market? https://www.frbsf.org/economic-research/files/wp2017-25.pdf https://www.frbsf.org/economic-research/files/wp2017-25.pdf
imgabe 7y ago
The only people with that problem are running sovereign wealth funds. IMO that should be invested in the infrastructure and social services of your nation to create a more educated and productive populace which will return the investment in the form of taxes.

CoolGuySteve 7y ago

If you look at the new residential sky scrapers like 432 Park around 10pm on a weeknight when most people should be home, you'll notice it's mostly dark. These tall expensive condo towers are like totems to the wealthy absentee residents of New York.

goldenkey 7y ago
You might enjoy this series: https://youtu.be/-55jtMMLJxk https://youtu.be/-55jtMMLJxk
bilbo0s 7y ago
Well maybe that's a bit of the problem. People are saying they can't get an apartment in NYC. Which is met by disbelief by people who actually live in NYC. I believe this might be due to the fact that people are really saying that they want a, say, lower Manhattan apartment but can't afford the good ones anywhere. These are probably upper middle class people trying to live a bit outside their means. It's not really that they can't afford NYC, they just don't want to live in Harlem. Or even in Brooklyn, which actually has pretty nice apartments. When I look around Harlem or the Bronx, I don't think, "empty". Not being able to live where the rich people live is not a problem that society should spend much time solving. I'm one of the very comfortable upper middle class. Yet I don't have a Ferrari, nor do I own a condo on Miami Beach. (Or Manhattan for that matter.) That doesn't mean that society has some sort of housing and car imbalance that it needs to address. There may indeed be an imbalance nationally, but NYC is definitely not any kind of example of one.
- bobbydroptables 7y ago
  NYC is definitely an example of a housing imbalance. It has nothing to do with UMC types not wanting to live in Harlem. It has to do with the fact that prices are ridiculous throughout the city. The quality of building you get for what you pay is way out of whack. The housing stock is old and generally low quality.
  - lotsofpulp 7y ago