4 ms·

But these are foreign corporations? I think I’m confused about how Russians, with offshore corporations, and foreign bank accounts, can suddenly be banhammered

But these are foreign corporations? I think I’m confused about how Russians, with offshore corporations, and foreign bank accounts, can suddenly be banhammered by the SEC...

davidgerard 7y ago
Where are the two corporations that substantially control your app being on phones located?
- seibelj 7y ago
  Ok so the SEC order really has teeth because they can use it to pressure Apple and google to remove telegram from their app stores? That’s a significantly less impressive penalty than what Internet lawyers have been telling me.
  - nl 7y ago
    There's a few other obvious things: They can sanction individual directors (ban them from holding office in any US corporation) They can freeze any US assets They can ban any US companies transacting with them
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
negamax 7y ago
Why do you think they are so keen to list in US?
jVinc 7y ago
You are right that they could conceptually have been operating entirely outside the US, which would shield them from any SEC actions... but of cause they aren't operating entirely outside of the US, and as such are not in any meaningful way shielded from SEC actions.
- bredren 7y ago
  Their people could get arrested while vacationing here.
PeterisP 7y ago
Telegram was implemented in Berlin and now is domiciled in UK; most of their operations, money and people are fully within reach of the western judicial system. While Durov comes from Russia, he is in exile and Telegram is structured to keep their money and people out of the reach of the Russian judicial system for various reasons. Also, a big part of their target audience of Gram early holders is in USA, so they also obviously care about the legality of these transactions. For them it's not sufficient to have some technical workaround that enables them to sell the tokens they have, they need a solution that allows them to do so legally.
- ryanlol 7y ago
  >Telegram was implemented in Berlin Why are you spreading this lie? It’s very well known by now that Telegram was primarily developed in St. Petersburg, in a building shared with VKontakte. https://twitter.com/bershidsky/status/910169626989953024 https://twitter.com/bershidsky/status/910169626989953024 https://twitter.com/ChristopherJM/status/910186197598838784 https://twitter.com/ChristopherJM/status/910186197598838784 https://theoutline.com/post/2348/what-isn-t-telegram-saying-about-its-connections-to-the-kremlin https://theoutline.com/post/2348/what-isn-t-telegram-saying-... >While Durov comes from Russia, he is in exile Durovs exile is very fleeting, normally you wouldn't visit the country you're in exile from... https://tjournal.ru/tech/52954-durov-back-in-ussr https://tjournal.ru/tech/52954-durov-back-in-ussr https://lenta.ru/news/2017/03/20/durov/ https://lenta.ru/news/2017/03/20/durov/ I should also add the obligatory note that Telegram has shipped obvious backdoors in the past allowing them to selectively decrypt secret chats https://habr.com/en/post/206900/ https://habr.com/en/post/206900/ lol @ the downvoting TON bagholders

But these are foreign corporations? I think I’m confused about how Russians, with offshore corporations, and foreign bank accounts, can suddenly be banhammered by the SEC...

davidgerard 7y ago

Where are the two corporations that substantially control your app being on phones located?

seibelj 7y ago
Ok so the SEC order really has teeth because they can use it to pressure Apple and google to remove telegram from their app stores? That’s a significantly less impressive penalty than what Internet lawyers have been telling me.
- nl 7y ago
  There's a few other obvious things: They can sanction individual directors (ban them from holding office in any US corporation) They can freeze any US assets They can ban any US companies transacting with them

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

negamax 7y ago

Why do you think they are so keen to list in US?

jVinc 7y ago

You are right that they could conceptually have been operating entirely outside the US, which would shield them from any SEC actions... but of cause they aren't operating entirely outside of the US, and as such are not in any meaningful way shielded from SEC actions.

bredren 7y ago
Their people could get arrested while vacationing here.

PeterisP 7y ago

Telegram was implemented in Berlin and now is domiciled in UK; most of their operations, money and people are fully within reach of the western judicial system. While Durov comes from Russia, he is in exile and Telegram is structured to keep their money and people out of the reach of the Russian judicial system for various reasons. Also, a big part of their target audience of Gram early holders is in USA, so they also obviously care about the legality of these transactions. For them it's not sufficient to have some technical workaround that enables them to sell the tokens they have, they need a solution that allows them to do so legally.

ryanlol 7y ago
>Telegram was implemented in Berlin Why are you spreading this lie? It’s very well known by now that Telegram was primarily developed in St. Petersburg, in a building shared with VKontakte. https://twitter.com/bershidsky/status/910169626989953024 https://twitter.com/bershidsky/status/910169626989953024 https://twitter.com/ChristopherJM/status/910186197598838784 https://twitter.com/ChristopherJM/status/910186197598838784 https://theoutline.com/post/2348/what-isn-t-telegram-saying-about-its-connections-to-the-kremlin https://theoutline.com/post/2348/what-isn-t-telegram-saying-... >While Durov comes from Russia, he is in exile Durovs exile is very fleeting, normally you wouldn't visit the country you're in exile from... https://tjournal.ru/tech/52954-durov-back-in-ussr https://tjournal.ru/tech/52954-durov-back-in-ussr https://lenta.ru/news/2017/03/20/durov/ https://lenta.ru/news/2017/03/20/durov/ I should also add the obligatory note that Telegram has shipped obvious backdoors in the past allowing them to selectively decrypt secret chats https://habr.com/en/post/206900/ https://habr.com/en/post/206900/ lol @ the downvoting TON bagholders