4 ms·

Time to run them in a VM with and old OS the same as older games?

bsamuels 7y ago
Can you imagine a world where someone who wants to play old Mac games has half a dozen VM containers with different versions of MacOS on them for each game that's compatible with each version? I can't
- _jal 7y ago
  This is probably more common than you might think. I don't play games much, but I do need some software that only runs on Windows, and do this. One VM is Win7, the other is Win10. Neither get network access, so I don't worry about either surveillance or updates. I also have a VM that runs a really old version of Debian, because I have a couple UPSes that don't support modern ssh. I suspect we'll also see phone emulation for compatibility becoming more of a thing. Granted, the vast bulk of that software is garbage that nobody cares about, but there are things seeing increasing enterprise use. Someone will go out of business and orphan something people count on at some point.
- deergomoo 7y ago
  Realistically, I'd be willing to bet the only old Mac games people are going to want to play are for classic Mac OS, in which case you already need to use a VM and have done for at least a decade. I'm struggling to think of any games in OS X era where the Mac would be even close to the easiest or best place to play them. I appreciate the notion that if you've bought the software you want to be able to keep using it for as long as possible, but we're talking about the niche-est of niches here.
- basementcat 7y ago
  Isn't this how node.js works now?
snagglegaggle 7y ago
Except this is explicitly against the TOS of macOS/OSX. This may be ok if you virtualize it on Apple hardware. Not that I care, and note the DMCA/property law has a specific exemption for defeating copy protection if you bought the thing. But it is more work than you make it out to be.
- ajconway 7y ago
  It's not against ToS to run VMs with Windows in them. It's also fine to virtualize a copy of macOS on an original hardware, but it hardly does anything for gaming as there is still no GPU acceleration available for macOS guests.
  - snagglegaggle 7y ago
    I was referring to macOS/OSX, but for Windows, it's actually against the licenses to virtualize anything but the Pro or Enterprise version. Considering the provisions in the DMCA about circumvention of copy protection being allowable, I'm not sure how enforceable this is. Turns out other comments confirm for macOS, but I was under the impression Apple hadn't commented on it, though a plain reading of the license indicated it was ok.
    - lloeki 7y ago
      > it's actually against the licenses to virtualize anything but the Pro or Enterprise version At some point it was OK to virtualise Home OEM versions as long as it was not running twice at the same time. The wording made it so you couldn’t virtualise Win on Win with the same license but virtualising in a host OS like Linux on the hardware the OEM license was tied to was allowed. I don’t know how that flied with non-OEM Home licenses or if even that changed at some point though.
- saagarjha 7y ago
  > Except this is explicitly against the TOS of macOS/OSX. This may be ok if you virtualize it on Apple hardware. It is ok to virtualize macOS on a Mac.
- 7y ago
toyg 7y ago
Games in a VM are often unplayable. Even something as old as the original Age of Empires is pretty bad when run under VirtualBox or VmWare Fusion.
- icebraining 7y ago
  That's curious, I've run games from that era (e.g. Starcraft) on a VM (Windows guest on Linux host) just fine. I don't think I even had hardware video acceleration working.

Can you imagine a world where someone who wants to play old Mac games has half a dozen VM containers with different versions of MacOS on them for each game that's compatible with each version? I can't

_jal 7y ago
This is probably more common than you might think. I don't play games much, but I do need some software that only runs on Windows, and do this. One VM is Win7, the other is Win10. Neither get network access, so I don't worry about either surveillance or updates. I also have a VM that runs a really old version of Debian, because I have a couple UPSes that don't support modern ssh. I suspect we'll also see phone emulation for compatibility becoming more of a thing. Granted, the vast bulk of that software is garbage that nobody cares about, but there are things seeing increasing enterprise use. Someone will go out of business and orphan something people count on at some point.
deergomoo 7y ago
Realistically, I'd be willing to bet the only old Mac games people are going to want to play are for classic Mac OS, in which case you already need to use a VM and have done for at least a decade. I'm struggling to think of any games in OS X era where the Mac would be even close to the easiest or best place to play them. I appreciate the notion that if you've bought the software you want to be able to keep using it for as long as possible, but we're talking about the niche-est of niches here.
basementcat 7y ago
Isn't this how node.js works now?

snagglegaggle 7y ago

Except this is explicitly against the TOS of macOS/OSX. This may be ok if you virtualize it on Apple hardware. Not that I care, and note the DMCA/property law has a specific exemption for defeating copy protection if you bought the thing. But it is more work than you make it out to be.

ajconway 7y ago
It's not against ToS to run VMs with Windows in them. It's also fine to virtualize a copy of macOS on an original hardware, but it hardly does anything for gaming as there is still no GPU acceleration available for macOS guests.
- snagglegaggle 7y ago
  I was referring to macOS/OSX, but for Windows, it's actually against the licenses to virtualize anything but the Pro or Enterprise version. Considering the provisions in the DMCA about circumvention of copy protection being allowable, I'm not sure how enforceable this is. Turns out other comments confirm for macOS, but I was under the impression Apple hadn't commented on it, though a plain reading of the license indicated it was ok.
  - lloeki 7y ago
    > it's actually against the licenses to virtualize anything but the Pro or Enterprise version At some point it was OK to virtualise Home OEM versions as long as it was not running twice at the same time. The wording made it so you couldn’t virtualise Win on Win with the same license but virtualising in a host OS like Linux on the hardware the OEM license was tied to was allowed. I don’t know how that flied with non-OEM Home licenses or if even that changed at some point though.
saagarjha 7y ago
> Except this is explicitly against the TOS of macOS/OSX. This may be ok if you virtualize it on Apple hardware. It is ok to virtualize macOS on a Mac.
7y ago

toyg 7y ago

Games in a VM are often unplayable. Even something as old as the original Age of Empires is pretty bad when run under VirtualBox or VmWare Fusion.

icebraining 7y ago
That's curious, I've run games from that era (e.g. Starcraft) on a VM (Windows guest on Linux host) just fine. I don't think I even had hardware video acceleration working.