5 ms·

I am gobsmacked that the state of California is allowing PG&E to downgrade their power infrastructure to near third world status. Next time there's an Amazon H

by reddog 7y ago

I am gobsmacked that the state of California is allowing PG&E to downgrade their power infrastructure to near third world status. Next time there's an Amazon HQ2 type competition between regions look for killer bullet points like "Texas: at least we have electricity!"

hn_throwaway_99 7y ago
While I see lots of problems with PG&E, the fact that they can basically face unlimited liability from something that is nowhere near entirely their fault (i.e. PG&E may be responsible for their equipment but the fact that climate change means one small spark is more likely to cause billions in damages and widespread destruction isn't PG&E's fault) means the system is broken. This is a case where normal tort liability makes for a failed system. Would be much better if there was a regulated system describing what PG&E is responsible for, and for building up a reserve for the fires that are inevitable.
- Someone1234 7y ago
  So PG&E get to make unlimited profits but the public has to eat the cost of their liabilities? They should just be a public utility in that case. Since someone is going to wind up eating the costs, and if not PG&E, then the public/taxpayer. Therefore may have well cut out the profit inefficiency and use that money to maintain their equipment correctly (or pay for damages). Private entities running natural monopolies never made sense to me anyway. PG&E don't even pretend to do it well.
  - hn_throwaway_99 7y ago
    > So PG&E get to make unlimited profits but the public has to eat the cost of their liabilities? "Unlimited profits"?? PG&E filed for bankruptcy this year, and filed in 2001. All electricity rates need to be approved California Public Utilities Commission. I agree, this weird mix of private ownership where everything needs to be approved by govt is basically the worst of all possible worlds (see also Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac), but it's not PG&E's fault alone that the system is so fucked. California has basically set up a regulatory regime where stable electricity generation is not viable.
- cgriswald 7y ago
  That’s like saying a drunk driver isn’t entirely to blame for killing pedestrians because there are more people walking about these days. The conditions under which these fires have started were not impossible in the past. Nor are those conditions even necessary for a fire. Any increased likelihood now is irrelevant since proper maintenance ought always have been done.
tomohawk 7y ago
Through their actions, CA has practically required it. Who is John Galt?
tzs 7y ago
> Next time there's an Amazon HQ2 type competition between regions look for killer bullet points like "Texas: at least we have electricity!" ...just be sure to budget for the occasional 36000% price spike [1]! [1] https://www.dallasnews.com/business/energy/2019/08/12/searing-heat-sends-texas-electricity-prices-to-scorching-6500-a-megawatt-hour/ https://www.dallasnews.com/business/energy/2019/08/12/searin...

by reddog 7y ago

hn_throwaway_99 7y ago

While I see lots of problems with PG&E, the fact that they can basically face unlimited liability from something that is nowhere near entirely their fault (i.e. PG&E may be responsible for their equipment but the fact that climate change means one small spark is more likely to cause billions in damages and widespread destruction isn't PG&E's fault) means the system is broken. This is a case where normal tort liability makes for a failed system. Would be much better if there was a regulated system describing what PG&E is responsible for, and for building up a reserve for the fires that are inevitable.

Someone1234 7y ago
So PG&E get to make unlimited profits but the public has to eat the cost of their liabilities? They should just be a public utility in that case. Since someone is going to wind up eating the costs, and if not PG&E, then the public/taxpayer. Therefore may have well cut out the profit inefficiency and use that money to maintain their equipment correctly (or pay for damages). Private entities running natural monopolies never made sense to me anyway. PG&E don't even pretend to do it well.
- hn_throwaway_99 7y ago
  > So PG&E get to make unlimited profits but the public has to eat the cost of their liabilities? "Unlimited profits"?? PG&E filed for bankruptcy this year, and filed in 2001. All electricity rates need to be approved California Public Utilities Commission. I agree, this weird mix of private ownership where everything needs to be approved by govt is basically the worst of all possible worlds (see also Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac), but it's not PG&E's fault alone that the system is so fucked. California has basically set up a regulatory regime where stable electricity generation is not viable.
cgriswald 7y ago
That’s like saying a drunk driver isn’t entirely to blame for killing pedestrians because there are more people walking about these days. The conditions under which these fires have started were not impossible in the past. Nor are those conditions even necessary for a fire. Any increased likelihood now is irrelevant since proper maintenance ought always have been done.

tomohawk 7y ago

Through their actions, CA has practically required it. Who is John Galt?

tzs 7y ago

> Next time there's an Amazon HQ2 type competition between regions look for killer bullet points like "Texas: at least we have electricity!" ...just be sure to budget for the occasional 36000% price spike [1]! [1] https://www.dallasnews.com/business/energy/2019/08/12/searing-heat-sends-texas-electricity-prices-to-scorching-6500-a-megawatt-hour/ https://www.dallasnews.com/business/energy/2019/08/12/searin...