3 ms·

Don't forget about drafts being synced between devices. I remember the first time I've noticed that: “Wait, didn't I write this on my phone? Why is this in my

Don't forget about drafts being synced between devices. I remember the first time I've noticed that: “Wait, didn't I write this on my phone? Why is this in my desktop client?”

lucb1e 7y ago
That's actually the only feature that has a bug (the rest works flawlessly): when I connect my phone to the internet after I started writing a message, even if I have the chat open and I'm actively typing and internet just connects in the background, then it'll literally erase what I typed so far with no warning or anything. It'll see that the server has no draft or an empty draft or something, and it'll just get rid of my message so far and there is no way of getting it back. Well, to be fair, there is also this other minor bug about encryption being off by default and only available on a few clients and not synchronizing between different encryption-supporting clients...
- eitland 7y ago
  > Well, to be fair, there is also this other minor bug about encryption being off by default and only available on a few clients and not synchronizing between different encryption-supporting clients... Here we go again. Encryption is not off by default. It is just not E2E encrypted, i.e. it works just like any bank, Gmail etc etc etc. (except, based on what I've heard Telegram, unlike any mainstream bank, put the extra effort in to keep encryption keys not only on separate servers but in a different jurisdiction than your messages.) Edit: Now if we could stop spreading misinformation we could discuss one thing that might be the real flaw in Telegrams model and which I would consider trying to move to a different messenger over - if they fixed it while delivering the same experience: The one huge issue I have with Telegram is the funding model. Whatsapp more or less nailed this early on: - low, reasonable price that still made them plenty profit - possibility to pay for others (kids, friends etc) Give me the same offer as Whatsapp once gave me: I pay them, they deliver my messages, provide quality clients on all platforms, doesn't snoop, doesn't spam etc, and I'll download the beta today. Provide a legally binding agreement that makes their company worthless and publishes the code under Apache or another liberal[0] license somehow if they sell out or becomes sleazy and I'll be walking around pondering how to help them. [0]: yep, I want it to be as simple as possible to make a good chunk of cash from transporting my messages securely and elegantly from my device to other peoples devices as well as the other way.
  - ryanlol 7y ago
    Telegram has shipped deliberate backdoors in the past, they can’t possibly be trusted https://m.habr.com/en/post/206900/ https://m.habr.com/en/post/206900/
    - eitland 7y ago
      I can't read Russian well enough to understand that ;-) What I know however is that I can't recall anyone except you[0] claiming that, not even tptacek. [0]: Thought I remembered your nick and had to look up: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Ryanlol+Telegram+site%3Anews.ycombinator.com&t=fpas&ia=web https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Ryanlol+Telegram+site%3Anews.ycomb...
      - ryanlol 7y ago
        https://twitter.com/FiloSottile/status/987376021589692416 https://twitter.com/FiloSottile/status/987376021589692416 Here you can see a couple of people with better CVs than mine discussing this. But I agree, it’s incredible that I’m probably the only person in the world constantly bringing this up re:telegram
        lucb1e 7y ago
        That is weird indeed, I never heard of this (and I'm relatively involved in Telegram-related thread / some tech groups on Telegram). It is fixed now, though. If it was ever a backdoor (which the thread does not conclusively say, just "backdoor looking" which sounds like either Telegram invented some unknown crypto that allows them to create a backdoor without anyone else having access, or an unfortunate mistake), it is no longer in there. As far as I know, this mtproto thing is weird but not broken. It is indeed something to be aware of though, I guess it's fair to bring it up, though I would not put it as black and white as "they backdoored it" when that is not actually certain. If you want to put it like that, you could also say that every vulnerability in the world could have been placed there intentionally. Which it could, but...
        7y ago

Don't forget about drafts being synced between devices. I remember the first time I've noticed that: “Wait, didn't I write this on my phone? Why is this in my desktop client?”

lucb1e 7y ago

That's actually the only feature that has a bug (the rest works flawlessly): when I connect my phone to the internet after I started writing a message, even if I have the chat open and I'm actively typing and internet just connects in the background, then it'll literally erase what I typed so far with no warning or anything. It'll see that the server has no draft or an empty draft or something, and it'll just get rid of my message so far and there is no way of getting it back. Well, to be fair, there is also this other minor bug about encryption being off by default and only available on a few clients and not synchronizing between different encryption-supporting clients...

eitland 7y ago
> Well, to be fair, there is also this other minor bug about encryption being off by default and only available on a few clients and not synchronizing between different encryption-supporting clients... Here we go again. Encryption is not off by default. It is just not E2E encrypted, i.e. it works just like any bank, Gmail etc etc etc. (except, based on what I've heard Telegram, unlike any mainstream bank, put the extra effort in to keep encryption keys not only on separate servers but in a different jurisdiction than your messages.) Edit: Now if we could stop spreading misinformation we could discuss one thing that might be the real flaw in Telegrams model and which I would consider trying to move to a different messenger over - if they fixed it while delivering the same experience: The one huge issue I have with Telegram is the funding model. Whatsapp more or less nailed this early on: - low, reasonable price that still made them plenty profit - possibility to pay for others (kids, friends etc) Give me the same offer as Whatsapp once gave me: I pay them, they deliver my messages, provide quality clients on all platforms, doesn't snoop, doesn't spam etc, and I'll download the beta today. Provide a legally binding agreement that makes their company worthless and publishes the code under Apache or another liberal[0] license somehow if they sell out or becomes sleazy and I'll be walking around pondering how to help them. [0]: yep, I want it to be as simple as possible to make a good chunk of cash from transporting my messages securely and elegantly from my device to other peoples devices as well as the other way.
- ryanlol 7y ago
  Telegram has shipped deliberate backdoors in the past, they can’t possibly be trusted https://m.habr.com/en/post/206900/ https://m.habr.com/en/post/206900/
  - eitland 7y ago
    I can't read Russian well enough to understand that ;-) What I know however is that I can't recall anyone except you[0] claiming that, not even tptacek. [0]: Thought I remembered your nick and had to look up: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Ryanlol+Telegram+site%3Anews.ycombinator.com&t=fpas&ia=web https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Ryanlol+Telegram+site%3Anews.ycomb...
    - ryanlol 7y ago
      https://twitter.com/FiloSottile/status/987376021589692416 https://twitter.com/FiloSottile/status/987376021589692416 Here you can see a couple of people with better CVs than mine discussing this. But I agree, it’s incredible that I’m probably the only person in the world constantly bringing this up re:telegram
      - lucb1e 7y ago
        That is weird indeed, I never heard of this (and I'm relatively involved in Telegram-related thread / some tech groups on Telegram). It is fixed now, though. If it was ever a backdoor (which the thread does not conclusively say, just "backdoor looking" which sounds like either Telegram invented some unknown crypto that allows them to create a backdoor without anyone else having access, or an unfortunate mistake), it is no longer in there. As far as I know, this mtproto thing is weird but not broken. It is indeed something to be aware of though, I guess it's fair to bring it up, though I would not put it as black and white as "they backdoored it" when that is not actually certain. If you want to put it like that, you could also say that every vulnerability in the world could have been placed there intentionally. Which it could, but...
        7y ago