10 ms·

I switched to Firefox after they stopped caring about usability issues (like right clicking without releasing left mouse button deselects the text since v fifty

I switched to Firefox after they stopped caring about usability issues (like right clicking without releasing left mouse button deselects the text since v fifty-something on windows), the difficulties they created for ad blockers, the account integration fiasco, and so on. I know this particular bug seems to be an edge case that may happen with every browser, but when you are using Chrome, you should know that if an issue doesn't affect Google, it will likely be deprioritized a lot. I'm not a self-acclaimed internet freedom fighter, I'm actually very pragmatic, and I'd still humbly suggest everyone to give Firefox a try.

King-Aaron 7y ago
> like right clicking without releasing left mouse button deselects the text since The text selection in the dev tools is woeful as well
microcolonel 7y ago
> I know this particular bug seems to be an edge case that may happen with every browser, but when you are using Chrome, you should know that if an issue doesn't affect Google, it will likely be deprioritized a lot. For what it's worth, I've found them responsive to my bug reports, and even my feature requests.
dehrmann 7y ago
> I'd still humbly suggest everyone to give Firefox a try. I usually suggest die-hard Chrome users use a plugin to spoof their user agent so product managers and developers are more likely to tread non-Chrome as a first-class browser.
- tobr 7y ago
  That’s some 4 dimensional chess.
- stockkid 7y ago
  Is there a such plug-in?
  - dalore 7y ago
    You can do it in chrome dev tools. Just pick which one or put a custom one in.
- Santosh83 7y ago
  I guess it's better than nothing but 1.) it will cause pages (especially some Google properties) to deliver unoptimised versions meant for the real Firefox (or more generally non-Chrome browsers), and 2.) don't sophisticated websites and apps anyway ignore user-agent string and directly probe through JS?
  - tracker1 7y ago
    As they should...but often don't (see unoptimized versions to your own comment).
sandGorgon 7y ago
Skype web doesn't work on Firefox and am still not able to fathom why
- realusername 7y ago
  They just block it by user agent, if you spoof it, everything is working well.
  - petre 7y ago
    I there a plugin to spoof the UA for certain sites only? Edit: it doesn't work.
    - realusername 7y ago
      I use this one: https://addons.mozilla.org/fr/firefox/addon/uaswitcher/ https://addons.mozilla.org/fr/firefox/addon/uaswitcher/, you can override per website or globally.
      - petre 7y ago
        Thanx, this one works.
    - rehemiau 7y ago
      Yes, I'm using this one in Firefox for Android: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/uaswitcher/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/uaswitcher/
    - Xorre 7y ago
      This should do the trick: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/user-agent-string-switcher/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/user-agent-st...
      - petre 7y ago
        That's what I tried to use but did not work at first. It works if you use block list mode and list .skype.com and .live.com. Heh. It's the same old web app from the works-in-firefox days.
2rsf 7y ago
> if an issue doesn't affect Google, it will likely be deprioritized a lot. And in Firefox ? someone still needs to prioritize issues, and issues affecting more people will get more attention in both browsers. As an immigrant struggling with a new language personally I need Chrome's right click to translate a page functionality in Firefox before I'll fully move
- Majestic121 7y ago
  Tada : https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/google-translator-for-firefox/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/google-transl...
  - icebraining 7y ago
    That now opens a new tab with Google Translate, which is annoying. I prefer https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/simple-translate/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/simple-transl...
    - foo_in_bar 7y ago
      +1 for Simple Translate. Simply select text, click the popup and done. I just wish there was option to quick change the output language (currently you can have like 2 target languages).
      - 2rsf 7y ago
        (I can't test now since I'm behind an evil proxy) seems like both are lacking the simplicity and elegance of Chrome's in-place translations
        bashinator 7y ago
        Well yes, when you (Google) control the entire vertical stack, you get nicer integrations like that.
octocode 7y ago
> I'd still humbly suggest everyone to give Firefox a try. I just can't get past the font weight rendering and the scroll bars. Is there any way to make them not look terrible?
sbhn 7y ago
Firefox synchronises as much personal data of your activity on there servers as they possibly can, and you don’t even know they are doing it.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
anon34568911 7y ago
Firefox could be a lot better with usability issues, too. They will agree on something being an issue and then let the ticket sit there for months and years, even if it's something that's easy to fix and should be prioritized.
- zbraniecki 7y ago
  "should be prioritized" is a very subjective statement. Out of every 100 tickets, there is 50 people who believe theirs is the most important one. And we have over 200k tickets total (not all are bugs, many are resolved, but the scale is massive). If you think a bug is easy to fix, pleasez consider providing a patch.
  - lultimouomo 7y ago
    I find it hard to believe you don't know that casually contributing to Firefox is ridiculously hard. The build system is borderline insane, building takes hours, and most importantly people who can approve your changes clearly have more important things to do and regularly fail to answer. I have tried contributing a couple of times. Thank you, no more.
    - roca 7y ago
      Compared to other software of similar complexity I think standing up a Firefox build is actually pretty reasonable. The bootstrap instructions are not complicated (https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Mozilla/Developer_guide/Build_Instructions/Simple_Firefox_build/Linux_and_MacOS_build_preparation https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Mozilla/Developer_g...) and the build takes about an hour on my laptop. Chrome is certainly a lot harder and takes significantly longer (if you lack access to Google's internal build farm). Likewise the Linux kernel is also tricky and slow to build the first time.
      - lultimouomo 7y ago
        I have found contributing to the linux kernel a significantly more pleasant experience than contributing to Firefox. I have no trouble believing that contributing to Chrome is even harder, but then again I didn't hear someone from Google saying "If you think a bug is easy to fix, pleasez consider providing a patch."
nly 7y ago
Given that Chrome ended Opera, and is effectively ending IE/Edge, people really need to take pause and appreciate and be thankful that Firefox is still around. I think the "shady shit" Mozilla has pulled lately are death rattles. I certainly don't expect it to be around in another 5-10 years. Firefox's tiny market share is all that stands between all the W3C and WHATG publications going from "standards" to "what Chromium does". Google is a giant corporation. One day they're going to do an IE6, and shift their focus away from the project, and the whole web will suffer.
- pawelmurias 7y ago
  Why would they ever do an IE6? They don't want to cripple the web as an application platform as MS did but move as much things as possible onto it.
  - mpol 7y ago
    "Doing an IE6" for Google would be quite different from what Microsoft did, who wanted the desktop to stay relevant. For Google the web is just an advertisement platform. If/When Firefix is gone, they will hold all the cards. "Doing an IE6" might mean removing support for ad-blockers. Or making Google DNS mandatory. Or have everything you do on the web be phoned to Google, to improve your advertising experience. Assume they will find creative ways to monetize the web, ways that we didn't even think of yet. If you thought the web in 2019 was bad, beware of the Google Future.
    - pavlov 7y ago
      AMP seems to be an example of the kind of web that (some parts of) Google wants. Hosted on their servers, transformed by their tools, commoditized and sanitized for ad insertion. Today when you navigate to google.com from Microsoft Edge, there's a barrage of popups urging you to use Chrome instead. When Chrome is completely dominant, maybe those popups will be on non-AMP sites urging you to "get the best experience"? It's guaranteed that there will be a lot of internal pressure to use Chrome to promote the goals of other divisions at Google.
    - 7y ago
askvictor 7y ago
I've recently started using FF for some uses, and find it quite laggy compared to Chrome (on Windows, even with dozens of extensions, and heaps of open tabs in Chrome, and one or two tabs on FF). I would like to use it, but performance wise doesn't seem to do for me, unfortunately.
- yoasif_ 7y ago
  It is worth reporting a performance problem if you can take a few minutes to record a profile and file a bug: https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Mozilla/Performance/Reporting_a_Performance_Problem https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Mozilla/Performance...
wycy 7y ago
I switched back to Firefox from Chrome with the introduction of Firefox Quantum after years of failed attempts at switching back prior to that. Firefox really is first class again. I echo your suggestion to give it a try again.
jedimastert 7y ago
> I know this particular bug seems to be an edge case that may happen with every browser, but when you are using Chrome, you should know that if an issue doesn't affect Google, it will likely be deprioritized a lot. Not to be that guy, but if you take a look at the bug a fix has been merged into 77
- hu3 7y ago
  And this is why I take rants against Google and MS with a grain of salt. Top voted comment couldn't bother to read bug report. I often see inconvenient truths buried in downvotes meanwhile misinformation that apeases a vocal minority gets catapulted to the top.
  - egeozcan 7y ago
    I've read the report. I knew about the merge. This issue has been postponed until developers started reacting aggressively, so breaking all drag and drop in iframes was nearly okay until a new version was published. When the issue is affecting users, it gets worse: The small number of them who could navigate their way into creating a chromium bug report will be waved away. I'm also not a comment, I'm a person. Thank you.
    - Guidii 7y ago
      The reported issue was addressed within 21 days. I'm not sure that this issue illustrates the case you're trying to make here.
      - egeozcan 7y ago
        I respectfully disagree: Try to explain your users that they won't get drag and drop for 21 days. This would have been worse if there weren't passionate people aggressively following it. A Google account integration issue would always be more important than web pages being broken in many subtle ways. This wasn't the case when they didn't hold the browser monopoly.
Slashbot 7y ago
Firefox is now complete shit.. Mozilla can go fuck themselves.. bunch of retards Use Vivaldi instead, they at least attempt to implementant decent and useful actual features... most of which used to be Firefox addons/. Seriously Mozilla go fuck yourselves.
wayneftw 7y ago
> ...after they stopped caring about usability issues... The bug is already fixed and has been released. What other issues are you talking about? I trust Mozilla less because they’re more desperate and desperate people are dangerous. They’re also ideologues who I don’t agree with, who often say one thing and do another. They preach privacy/control for users while simultaneously selling them out, removing control and inserting ads where there should be none.
techntoke 7y ago
I've noticed recently that the configuration for Mozilla is actually more difficult to disable all the privacy-impacting options and they are in more obscure locations, than with Chromium. The only exception being once you enable sync in Chrome-based browsers it will add additional options that then have to be disabled as well.
shadowgovt 7y ago
Subjectively, most of the performance regressions I've had have been in Firefox, sadly. They had an issue that absolutely torpedoed flexbox performance for quite some time, for example. It has since been resolved, but it's still the leading cause of performance complaints I see from my users.

King-Aaron 7y ago

> like right clicking without releasing left mouse button deselects the text since The text selection in the dev tools is woeful as well

microcolonel 7y ago

> I know this particular bug seems to be an edge case that may happen with every browser, but when you are using Chrome, you should know that if an issue doesn't affect Google, it will likely be deprioritized a lot. For what it's worth, I've found them responsive to my bug reports, and even my feature requests.

dehrmann 7y ago

> I'd still humbly suggest everyone to give Firefox a try. I usually suggest die-hard Chrome users use a plugin to spoof their user agent so product managers and developers are more likely to tread non-Chrome as a first-class browser.

tobr 7y ago
That’s some 4 dimensional chess.
stockkid 7y ago
Is there a such plug-in?
- dalore 7y ago
  You can do it in chrome dev tools. Just pick which one or put a custom one in.
Santosh83 7y ago
I guess it's better than nothing but 1.) it will cause pages (especially some Google properties) to deliver unoptimised versions meant for the real Firefox (or more generally non-Chrome browsers), and 2.) don't sophisticated websites and apps anyway ignore user-agent string and directly probe through JS?
- tracker1 7y ago
  As they should...but often don't (see unoptimized versions to your own comment).

sandGorgon 7y ago

Skype web doesn't work on Firefox and am still not able to fathom why

realusername 7y ago
They just block it by user agent, if you spoof it, everything is working well.
- petre 7y ago
  I there a plugin to spoof the UA for certain sites only? Edit: it doesn't work.
  - realusername 7y ago
    I use this one: https://addons.mozilla.org/fr/firefox/addon/uaswitcher/ https://addons.mozilla.org/fr/firefox/addon/uaswitcher/, you can override per website or globally.
    - petre 7y ago
      Thanx, this one works.
  - rehemiau 7y ago
    Yes, I'm using this one in Firefox for Android: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/uaswitcher/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/uaswitcher/
  - Xorre 7y ago
    This should do the trick: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/user-agent-string-switcher/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/user-agent-st...
    - petre 7y ago
      That's what I tried to use but did not work at first. It works if you use block list mode and list .skype.com and .live.com. Heh. It's the same old web app from the works-in-firefox days.

2rsf 7y ago

> if an issue doesn't affect Google, it will likely be deprioritized a lot. And in Firefox ? someone still needs to prioritize issues, and issues affecting more people will get more attention in both browsers. As an immigrant struggling with a new language personally I need Chrome's right click to translate a page functionality in Firefox before I'll fully move

Majestic121 7y ago
Tada : https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/google-translator-for-firefox/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/google-transl...
- icebraining 7y ago
  That now opens a new tab with Google Translate, which is annoying. I prefer https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/simple-translate/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/simple-transl...
  - foo_in_bar 7y ago
    +1 for Simple Translate. Simply select text, click the popup and done. I just wish there was option to quick change the output language (currently you can have like 2 target languages).
    - 2rsf 7y ago
      (I can't test now since I'm behind an evil proxy) seems like both are lacking the simplicity and elegance of Chrome's in-place translations
      - bashinator 7y ago
        Well yes, when you (Google) control the entire vertical stack, you get nicer integrations like that.

octocode 7y ago

> I'd still humbly suggest everyone to give Firefox a try. I just can't get past the font weight rendering and the scroll bars. Is there any way to make them not look terrible?

sbhn 7y ago

Firefox synchronises as much personal data of your activity on there servers as they possibly can, and you don’t even know they are doing it.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

anon34568911 7y ago

Firefox could be a lot better with usability issues, too. They will agree on something being an issue and then let the ticket sit there for months and years, even if it's something that's easy to fix and should be prioritized.

zbraniecki 7y ago
"should be prioritized" is a very subjective statement. Out of every 100 tickets, there is 50 people who believe theirs is the most important one. And we have over 200k tickets total (not all are bugs, many are resolved, but the scale is massive). If you think a bug is easy to fix, pleasez consider providing a patch.
- lultimouomo 7y ago
  I find it hard to believe you don't know that casually contributing to Firefox is ridiculously hard. The build system is borderline insane, building takes hours, and most importantly people who can approve your changes clearly have more important things to do and regularly fail to answer. I have tried contributing a couple of times. Thank you, no more.
  - roca 7y ago
    Compared to other software of similar complexity I think standing up a Firefox build is actually pretty reasonable. The bootstrap instructions are not complicated (https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Mozilla/Developer_guide/Build_Instructions/Simple_Firefox_build/Linux_and_MacOS_build_preparation https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Mozilla/Developer_g...) and the build takes about an hour on my laptop. Chrome is certainly a lot harder and takes significantly longer (if you lack access to Google's internal build farm). Likewise the Linux kernel is also tricky and slow to build the first time.
    - lultimouomo 7y ago
      I have found contributing to the linux kernel a significantly more pleasant experience than contributing to Firefox. I have no trouble believing that contributing to Chrome is even harder, but then again I didn't hear someone from Google saying "If you think a bug is easy to fix, pleasez consider providing a patch."

nly 7y ago

Given that Chrome ended Opera, and is effectively ending IE/Edge, people really need to take pause and appreciate and be thankful that Firefox is still around. I think the "shady shit" Mozilla has pulled lately are death rattles. I certainly don't expect it to be around in another 5-10 years. Firefox's tiny market share is all that stands between all the W3C and WHATG publications going from "standards" to "what Chromium does". Google is a giant corporation. One day they're going to do an IE6, and shift their focus away from the project, and the whole web will suffer.

pawelmurias 7y ago
Why would they ever do an IE6? They don't want to cripple the web as an application platform as MS did but move as much things as possible onto it.
- mpol 7y ago
  "Doing an IE6" for Google would be quite different from what Microsoft did, who wanted the desktop to stay relevant. For Google the web is just an advertisement platform. If/When Firefix is gone, they will hold all the cards. "Doing an IE6" might mean removing support for ad-blockers. Or making Google DNS mandatory. Or have everything you do on the web be phoned to Google, to improve your advertising experience. Assume they will find creative ways to monetize the web, ways that we didn't even think of yet. If you thought the web in 2019 was bad, beware of the Google Future.
  - pavlov 7y ago
    AMP seems to be an example of the kind of web that (some parts of) Google wants. Hosted on their servers, transformed by their tools, commoditized and sanitized for ad insertion. Today when you navigate to google.com from Microsoft Edge, there's a barrage of popups urging you to use Chrome instead. When Chrome is completely dominant, maybe those popups will be on non-AMP sites urging you to "get the best experience"? It's guaranteed that there will be a lot of internal pressure to use Chrome to promote the goals of other divisions at Google.
  - 7y ago

askvictor 7y ago

I've recently started using FF for some uses, and find it quite laggy compared to Chrome (on Windows, even with dozens of extensions, and heaps of open tabs in Chrome, and one or two tabs on FF). I would like to use it, but performance wise doesn't seem to do for me, unfortunately.

yoasif_ 7y ago
It is worth reporting a performance problem if you can take a few minutes to record a profile and file a bug: https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Mozilla/Performance/Reporting_a_Performance_Problem https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Mozilla/Performance...

wycy 7y ago

I switched back to Firefox from Chrome with the introduction of Firefox Quantum after years of failed attempts at switching back prior to that. Firefox really is first class again. I echo your suggestion to give it a try again.

jedimastert 7y ago

> I know this particular bug seems to be an edge case that may happen with every browser, but when you are using Chrome, you should know that if an issue doesn't affect Google, it will likely be deprioritized a lot. Not to be that guy, but if you take a look at the bug a fix has been merged into 77

hu3 7y ago
And this is why I take rants against Google and MS with a grain of salt. Top voted comment couldn't bother to read bug report. I often see inconvenient truths buried in downvotes meanwhile misinformation that apeases a vocal minority gets catapulted to the top.
- egeozcan 7y ago
  I've read the report. I knew about the merge. This issue has been postponed until developers started reacting aggressively, so breaking all drag and drop in iframes was nearly okay until a new version was published. When the issue is affecting users, it gets worse: The small number of them who could navigate their way into creating a chromium bug report will be waved away. I'm also not a comment, I'm a person. Thank you.
  - Guidii 7y ago
    The reported issue was addressed within 21 days. I'm not sure that this issue illustrates the case you're trying to make here.
    - egeozcan 7y ago
      I respectfully disagree: Try to explain your users that they won't get drag and drop for 21 days. This would have been worse if there weren't passionate people aggressively following it. A Google account integration issue would always be more important than web pages being broken in many subtle ways. This wasn't the case when they didn't hold the browser monopoly.

Slashbot 7y ago

Firefox is now complete shit.. Mozilla can go fuck themselves.. bunch of retards Use Vivaldi instead, they at least attempt to implementant decent and useful actual features... most of which used to be Firefox addons/. Seriously Mozilla go fuck yourselves.

wayneftw 7y ago

> ...after they stopped caring about usability issues... The bug is already fixed and has been released. What other issues are you talking about? I trust Mozilla less because they’re more desperate and desperate people are dangerous. They’re also ideologues who I don’t agree with, who often say one thing and do another. They preach privacy/control for users while simultaneously selling them out, removing control and inserting ads where there should be none.

techntoke 7y ago

I've noticed recently that the configuration for Mozilla is actually more difficult to disable all the privacy-impacting options and they are in more obscure locations, than with Chromium. The only exception being once you enable sync in Chrome-based browsers it will add additional options that then have to be disabled as well.

shadowgovt 7y ago

Subjectively, most of the performance regressions I've had have been in Firefox, sadly. They had an issue that absolutely torpedoed flexbox performance for quite some time, for example. It has since been resolved, but it's still the leading cause of performance complaints I see from my users.