4 ms·

I've fallen for these mega-corp's marketing bullshit many times over the years: It's easy done! It's also easy to forget that they only care about appeasing sh

I've fallen for these mega-corp's marketing bullshit many times over the years: It's easy done! It's also easy to forget that they only care about appeasing shareholders and the way to do that is to make money. At any cost! I am currently working on a (personal) .NET Core project so I'm using Windows 10 but when it's up and running I am going to spend some serious time looking into Linux instead and developing my .NET core stuff there. I'm also waiting for the Librem 5 now: All other phones are thinly-veiled spyware as far as I am concerned. *takes off rose-tinted glasses! Edit: changed focus from Apple to mega-corps instead

gremlinsinc 7y ago
I'm not really a .net person, I'm mostly php w/ some nodejs/golang/elixir but I tried .net and tooling and things at least work now on arch linux where I don't think they would've 5-10 years ago. Apple's imho one of the worst players, they have the most closed ecosystem imaginable it should be illegal to require a developer to buy your hardware just to develop apps on your platform. I'll never support or use an apple unless mandated by a client and they'll need to supply the hardware. Google's bad too but at least I can side-load apps and install custom rom's easily enough.
- orloffm 7y ago
  They don't actually work on Arch - it's the only distro without official .NET Core SDK package, and the community-provided version has too many issues (https://www.reddit.com/r/archlinux/comments/cx64r5/the_state_of_net_core_on_arch/ https://www.reddit.com/r/archlinux/comments/cx64r5/the_state...). Not sure if there is 3.0 SDK yet.
m0xte 7y ago
I would walk away from .Net Core as well. Microsoft have proven themselves on several occasions that they don't give a crap about the end user. The whole default opt-in telemetry nightmare of .Net core is an example. The final result of the discussion was a "fuck you, we're still doing it" and nothing more. Also getting support on anything is now basically "it's open source, raise a ticket we'll never fix". And not to mention the insane versioning, churn and schizophrenic direction changes. Same old corporation. They just worked out how to label customers as consumers and pacify the userbase by putting it on GitHub instead of Connect and reducing the support availability (have you tried getting desktop support, even paid per incident on windows 10? Don't bother!) For me a software ecosystem has to stand 100% alone for me to invest in it. That basically leaves Python and C at this point which I'm honestly not that unhappy with.
- romanovcode 7y ago
  > opt-in telemetry nightmare of .Net core `export DOTNET_CLI_TELEMETRY_OPTOUT=1`. Wow, such nightmare.
  - m0xte 7y ago
    They actually broke it so that didn't work for a bit. That's enough to cause a major issue in some organisations with strict security policies. Opt in telemetry is fine. Opt out definitely not. This is a major inversion of policy.
- _Understated_ 7y ago
  On that note, what ecosystem gives me the coverage that .NET gives? I've been Microsoft-focused for 20+ years. By ecosystem I mean, an IDE as good as Visual Studio and the simplicity of pressing F5 to test my code... that sort of thing.
  - m0xte 7y ago
    I've been using Microsoft stacks since 1991. I am at home with Python, an editor and a terminal at this point. F5 to run is terribly inefficient in the long run (wait until you get a 2MLOC recompile and then secondary compile when your project is starting in IIS)
  - tonyedgecombe 7y ago
    Java I suppose, but then aren't you just replacing Microsoft with Oracle. I know what you mean though, I've been a VS user for a long time and find it very productive.
- majewsky 7y ago
  > default opt-in telemetry You mean opt-out. Opt-in is when it's off by default.

gremlinsinc 7y ago

I'm not really a .net person, I'm mostly php w/ some nodejs/golang/elixir but I tried .net and tooling and things at least work now on arch linux where I don't think they would've 5-10 years ago. Apple's imho one of the worst players, they have the most closed ecosystem imaginable it should be illegal to require a developer to buy your hardware just to develop apps on your platform. I'll never support or use an apple unless mandated by a client and they'll need to supply the hardware. Google's bad too but at least I can side-load apps and install custom rom's easily enough.

orloffm 7y ago
They don't actually work on Arch - it's the only distro without official .NET Core SDK package, and the community-provided version has too many issues (https://www.reddit.com/r/archlinux/comments/cx64r5/the_state_of_net_core_on_arch/ https://www.reddit.com/r/archlinux/comments/cx64r5/the_state...). Not sure if there is 3.0 SDK yet.

m0xte 7y ago

I would walk away from .Net Core as well. Microsoft have proven themselves on several occasions that they don't give a crap about the end user. The whole default opt-in telemetry nightmare of .Net core is an example. The final result of the discussion was a "fuck you, we're still doing it" and nothing more. Also getting support on anything is now basically "it's open source, raise a ticket we'll never fix". And not to mention the insane versioning, churn and schizophrenic direction changes. Same old corporation. They just worked out how to label customers as consumers and pacify the userbase by putting it on GitHub instead of Connect and reducing the support availability (have you tried getting desktop support, even paid per incident on windows 10? Don't bother!) For me a software ecosystem has to stand 100% alone for me to invest in it. That basically leaves Python and C at this point which I'm honestly not that unhappy with.

romanovcode 7y ago
> opt-in telemetry nightmare of .Net core `export DOTNET_CLI_TELEMETRY_OPTOUT=1`. Wow, such nightmare.
- m0xte 7y ago
  They actually broke it so that didn't work for a bit. That's enough to cause a major issue in some organisations with strict security policies. Opt in telemetry is fine. Opt out definitely not. This is a major inversion of policy.
_Understated_ 7y ago
On that note, what ecosystem gives me the coverage that .NET gives? I've been Microsoft-focused for 20+ years. By ecosystem I mean, an IDE as good as Visual Studio and the simplicity of pressing F5 to test my code... that sort of thing.
- m0xte 7y ago
  I've been using Microsoft stacks since 1991. I am at home with Python, an editor and a terminal at this point. F5 to run is terribly inefficient in the long run (wait until you get a 2MLOC recompile and then secondary compile when your project is starting in IIS)
- tonyedgecombe 7y ago
  Java I suppose, but then aren't you just replacing Microsoft with Oracle. I know what you mean though, I've been a VS user for a long time and find it very productive.
majewsky 7y ago
> default opt-in telemetry You mean opt-out. Opt-in is when it's off by default.