4 ms·

> And you're displacing fossil fuel use with a material that can be recycled, so instead of constantly mining for fossil fuels, we can just extract the materia

> And you're displacing fossil fuel use with a material that can be recycled, so instead of constantly mining for fossil fuels, we can just extract the material once. I was wondering about the recycling aspects of Lithium. According to Wikipedia, it's not a thing (yet?), because mining lithium is 5x cheaper than recycling. But they're working on it...

Robotbeat 7y ago
It's a thing, but it's done at a small scale. And prices of lithium have started to climb to the point that it is looking attractive. And there's a simple solution, here: have companies (including foreign, via tariffs) pay for the fully burdened cost of the environmental damage they're inflicting. That'll end virtually all fossil fuel usage and enable recycling and/or exclusively low-impact mining techniques.
- rory096 7y ago
  >including foreign, via tariffs Border adjustments, not tariffs.
ajross 7y ago
The most constrained components elements in lithium ion batteries are not lithium itself (which is very common in the Earth's crust, though tends not to concentrate in easily minable ores) but the heavy metals like Cobalt used in the cathode. These will be the first focus for recycling.
- e9 7y ago
  lithium is common but to get it's hard to extract, highest concentration is 0.14%(https://investingnews.com/daily/resource-investing/battery-metals-investing/lithium-investing/lithium-deposit-types-brine-pegmatite-and-sedimentary/ https://investingnews.com/daily/resource-investing/battery-m...) which means in 1 cubic feet of brine there are 0.0014 cubic feet of lithium. Imagine how much power it takes to dig it out (definitely monster construction machinery ran on fossil fuels etc) and then add extraction process to that. I would be interested to see if there are any sources digging deeper into it.
  - Robotbeat 7y ago
    Interestingly, lithium ion technology is also transforming "monster" mining equipment to run on pure electricity: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UH4XgPN65Q https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UH4XgPN65Q (and this especially helps with underground mining) But also, the brine is simply pumped. It's liquid.
  - ajross 7y ago
    It's not cheap to refine, but it's not going to "run out", so relevant to the upthread point the calculus on mine-vs-recycle isn't likely to change much.

Robotbeat 7y ago

It's a thing, but it's done at a small scale. And prices of lithium have started to climb to the point that it is looking attractive. And there's a simple solution, here: have companies (including foreign, via tariffs) pay for the fully burdened cost of the environmental damage they're inflicting. That'll end virtually all fossil fuel usage and enable recycling and/or exclusively low-impact mining techniques.

rory096 7y ago
>including foreign, via tariffs Border adjustments, not tariffs.

ajross 7y ago

The most constrained components elements in lithium ion batteries are not lithium itself (which is very common in the Earth's crust, though tends not to concentrate in easily minable ores) but the heavy metals like Cobalt used in the cathode. These will be the first focus for recycling.

e9 7y ago
lithium is common but to get it's hard to extract, highest concentration is 0.14%(https://investingnews.com/daily/resource-investing/battery-metals-investing/lithium-investing/lithium-deposit-types-brine-pegmatite-and-sedimentary/ https://investingnews.com/daily/resource-investing/battery-m...) which means in 1 cubic feet of brine there are 0.0014 cubic feet of lithium. Imagine how much power it takes to dig it out (definitely monster construction machinery ran on fossil fuels etc) and then add extraction process to that. I would be interested to see if there are any sources digging deeper into it.
- Robotbeat 7y ago
  Interestingly, lithium ion technology is also transforming "monster" mining equipment to run on pure electricity: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UH4XgPN65Q https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UH4XgPN65Q (and this especially helps with underground mining) But also, the brine is simply pumped. It's liquid.
- ajross 7y ago
  It's not cheap to refine, but it's not going to "run out", so relevant to the upthread point the calculus on mine-vs-recycle isn't likely to change much.