3 ms·

Apple is still good. But their business model is aligned to be good stewards of the user unlike Facebook or Google. Microsoft and Apple products are irreplaceab

Apple is still good. But their business model is aligned to be good stewards of the user unlike Facebook or Google. Microsoft and Apple products are irreplaceable today as well, while Google and Facebook offer convenience but no necessary value.

peterwwillis 7y ago
> Apple is still good I think you miss my point... an entire company can't be "good". "Apple" is a brand. You may like a lot of their products, but they also have some products with shit features, and they sometimes do "things" that are not so much "good" for "the users" as they are good for the company. Their MacBook Pro keyboards are the worst in the industry. They make it so a user can't repair a product that they own. They censor application platforms based on the country a user is in. The majority of their products are a "captive market", often impossible to use with anything but another Apple product. There's many things Apple does that are against the users. But here you are, enjoying some of their products, so you call their entire brand, and presumably their entire product line, "good". How does one define "good", then? Good enough for all? For some? For you? Good in quality? Good morally or ethically, and if so, based on whose morals/ethics? Do the people and places they effect outside of their immediate users matter? I don't think it's useful to think of an entire brand in such a simplistic way. BTW, Google and Facebook offer necessary value. Facebook is used to keep up with people's lives (without it, many grandparents would know next to nothing of the lives of their grandchildren, for example) and encompasses two of the largest instant messaging platforms. Google is probably the biggest provider of e-mail, an absolutely essential component of having an online life (which is increasingly necessary for more of regular life, from getting a ride somewhere, to accessing government services, to transferring funds), to say nothing of search, maps, docs. And many of these services would be pointless without the Apple/Google/Microsoft platforms, but many of those platforms would be pointless without the services. So what's "necessary" is a bit subjective. (Caveat to all of the above: Fuck Oracle.)
- BuckRogers 7y ago
  Facebook/Google are both easily replaceable, that's why they have no intrinsic value they create. I can use Outlook.com or iCloud.com and I have the original social network (or, pickup the phone or write a letter). DuckDuckGo grants me search. Altavista was pretty good too. I don't prefer all of Apple products, although I do like them all. I use a Thinkpad X1 Extreme for work, and also have a 2019 Samsung Notebook 9 Pen. We do use iPhones in this house. I thought "good" was a light-way of putting. Overall, all things considered I'd go up a notch to "best". You may have been rattled by me calling Apple "good", but if I have to light a fire on all of these companies except one, I'd leave Apple intact. I could easily and happily use their entire lineup. The Macbooks aren't "that bad". ;) Hardly junk, and even their lowend isn't junk. I like the Macbook Air quite a bit and recommend it often. Quality across the entire line is what I expect from everyone, but it's why Apple is the best. They are even relatively privacy conscious. Even if I'm a best of breed person. Apple is so dominant in the quality realm that I would say their products are best for everyone. You can't go wrong with a Mac, especially when sorting through all the junk on the market to get to my X1 Extreme and Notebook 9 Pen is honestly, fraught with peril. It requires good judgement and people often fail at that. They will go for the lower-lines because they think they're the "same" as the top of the line, and that's very much not true, outside of Apple. I would recommend most people just go to the Apple Store. None of it is junk, and you have a store to take it to for repairs if you do have problems. Can't beat it. Better than "good"- best. If I were dying, I would tell my wife to keep an eye on Consumer Reports, but that she can safely continue to invest in Apple products for the foreseeable future after my death. That's how strong their track record has been. I am one that believes an organization can earn goodwill, not just anger and bad will.

peterwwillis 7y ago

> Apple is still good I think you miss my point... an entire company can't be "good". "Apple" is a brand. You may like a lot of their products, but they also have some products with shit features, and they sometimes do "things" that are not so much "good" for "the users" as they are good for the company. Their MacBook Pro keyboards are the worst in the industry. They make it so a user can't repair a product that they own. They censor application platforms based on the country a user is in. The majority of their products are a "captive market", often impossible to use with anything but another Apple product. There's many things Apple does that are against the users. But here you are, enjoying some of their products, so you call their entire brand, and presumably their entire product line, "good". How does one define "good", then? Good enough for all? For some? For you? Good in quality? Good morally or ethically, and if so, based on whose morals/ethics? Do the people and places they effect outside of their immediate users matter? I don't think it's useful to think of an entire brand in such a simplistic way. BTW, Google and Facebook offer necessary value. Facebook is used to keep up with people's lives (without it, many grandparents would know next to nothing of the lives of their grandchildren, for example) and encompasses two of the largest instant messaging platforms. Google is probably the biggest provider of e-mail, an absolutely essential component of having an online life (which is increasingly necessary for more of regular life, from getting a ride somewhere, to accessing government services, to transferring funds), to say nothing of search, maps, docs. And many of these services would be pointless without the Apple/Google/Microsoft platforms, but many of those platforms would be pointless without the services. So what's "necessary" is a bit subjective. (Caveat to all of the above: Fuck Oracle.)

BuckRogers 7y ago
Facebook/Google are both easily replaceable, that's why they have no intrinsic value they create. I can use Outlook.com or iCloud.com and I have the original social network (or, pickup the phone or write a letter). DuckDuckGo grants me search. Altavista was pretty good too. I don't prefer all of Apple products, although I do like them all. I use a Thinkpad X1 Extreme for work, and also have a 2019 Samsung Notebook 9 Pen. We do use iPhones in this house. I thought "good" was a light-way of putting. Overall, all things considered I'd go up a notch to "best". You may have been rattled by me calling Apple "good", but if I have to light a fire on all of these companies except one, I'd leave Apple intact. I could easily and happily use their entire lineup. The Macbooks aren't "that bad". ;) Hardly junk, and even their lowend isn't junk. I like the Macbook Air quite a bit and recommend it often. Quality across the entire line is what I expect from everyone, but it's why Apple is the best. They are even relatively privacy conscious. Even if I'm a best of breed person. Apple is so dominant in the quality realm that I would say their products are best for everyone. You can't go wrong with a Mac, especially when sorting through all the junk on the market to get to my X1 Extreme and Notebook 9 Pen is honestly, fraught with peril. It requires good judgement and people often fail at that. They will go for the lower-lines because they think they're the "same" as the top of the line, and that's very much not true, outside of Apple. I would recommend most people just go to the Apple Store. None of it is junk, and you have a store to take it to for repairs if you do have problems. Can't beat it. Better than "good"- best. If I were dying, I would tell my wife to keep an eye on Consumer Reports, but that she can safely continue to invest in Apple products for the foreseeable future after my death. That's how strong their track record has been. I am one that believes an organization can earn goodwill, not just anger and bad will.