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Voter ID laws and Poll closures both target specific voting blocs with strong party affiliations intentionally and (often) explicitly. Both make it harder to vo

by rtkwe 7y ago

Voter ID laws and Poll closures both target specific voting blocs with strong party affiliations intentionally and (often) explicitly. Both make it harder to vote. In a perfect world ID laws could be ok but it would require a huge project to ensure every legal voter had some form of ID, eg. going door to door to ensure people who have trouble getting to out of the way DMV locations don't get left out and assistance with gathering any required documents, so far none of them have included this crucial step. It doesn't help that the number of voter fraud incidents is vanishingly small so the supposed issue voter ID laws are supposed to be addressing is a lie.

arkh 7y ago
Maybe people could how it's done in other countries. Here in France: when I move to a new city I go register with an ID. Then before elections I receive a voting card. Also: elections are on Sunday so most working people can go vote if they want to.
- rtkwe 7y ago
  I'm not 100% clear on what you mean, sounds like automatic voter registration, ie when you go to the DMV to get your license/ID you're automatically registered to vote? That would help a lot and I'd love to see it but it only deals with one side and doesn't solve the issue of people who are legally able to vote but don't have a current ID. I'd also love to see election day moved to a Sunday or be made a federal holiday with some requirement that everyone be given sufficient (potentially paid?) time to vote.
  - taborj 7y ago
    Oregon has a "motor voter" act, where you are automatically registered to vote if you have a driver's license (and are of age). We also do vote by mail, so it doesn't matter when the election day is. Just send in (or drop off) your ballot before voting closes.
  - arkh 7y ago
    > when you go to the DMV to get your license/ID you're automatically registered to vote? No. First thing to understand is you are required to have a valid ID (ID card, passport or driver's license) so almost everyone has at least an ID card (even children). You have to go register to be able to vote in a city. You don't have to change when you move but it is easier to vote where you live instead of going back to where you lived 3 years ago.
- pyrale 7y ago
  Voter suppression is not nearly comparable in France and in the US. The system used in France would thus likely not work. For instance imagine that the voting enrollment office is 30km from your work/home and that it is only open during work hours. It is likely that poor people/people without a car/etc would not enroll.
pdonis 7y ago
> it would require a huge project to ensure every legal voter had some form of ID Without an ID, how do people at polling places know they're a legal voter? Using the honor system made sense a century or two ago when most people lived all their lives in the same place where they grew up and everyone at the polling place knew everybody. But that's not the case now and hasn't been for a long time. With all the talk about securing our election process against tampering (which I'm all in favor of), if it doesn't include voter ID, it's not secure. > the number of voter fraud incidents is vanishingly small The number of known voter fraud incidents is very small. But if ID isn't required to vote and we just accept people's word when they say they're eligible to vote, how could you ever prove voter fraud?
- crooked-v 7y ago
  > how could you ever prove voter fraud? There have been expansive studies on the subject, all of which have found incredibly low rates of actual voter fraud (as distinct from clerical errors or mistakenly voting at the wrong precinct): https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/research-reports/debunking-voter-fraud-myth https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/research-reports/debu...
  - Vaslo 7y ago
    Far left organization, seems like a fair and unbiased source of information
    - crooked-v 7y ago
      What does that matter? It's a page of links to peer-reviewed studies, legal opinions, and article from major journalism outlets, not an opinion piece.
      - Vaslo 7y ago
        Yes, I'm sure it diligently looked at reviews that were opposite or critical of those studies and decided it would further their cause to list them. Where is the list that refutes this data? Here's a hint, a little searching on Google will show you that there are opposing organizations who, conveniently, leave out this far left website's "legitimate reviews" in favor of ones that follow THEIR side.

by rtkwe 7y ago

arkh 7y ago

Maybe people could how it's done in other countries. Here in France: when I move to a new city I go register with an ID. Then before elections I receive a voting card. Also: elections are on Sunday so most working people can go vote if they want to.

rtkwe 7y ago
I'm not 100% clear on what you mean, sounds like automatic voter registration, ie when you go to the DMV to get your license/ID you're automatically registered to vote? That would help a lot and I'd love to see it but it only deals with one side and doesn't solve the issue of people who are legally able to vote but don't have a current ID. I'd also love to see election day moved to a Sunday or be made a federal holiday with some requirement that everyone be given sufficient (potentially paid?) time to vote.
- taborj 7y ago
  Oregon has a "motor voter" act, where you are automatically registered to vote if you have a driver's license (and are of age). We also do vote by mail, so it doesn't matter when the election day is. Just send in (or drop off) your ballot before voting closes.
- arkh 7y ago
  > when you go to the DMV to get your license/ID you're automatically registered to vote? No. First thing to understand is you are required to have a valid ID (ID card, passport or driver's license) so almost everyone has at least an ID card (even children). You have to go register to be able to vote in a city. You don't have to change when you move but it is easier to vote where you live instead of going back to where you lived 3 years ago.
pyrale 7y ago
Voter suppression is not nearly comparable in France and in the US. The system used in France would thus likely not work. For instance imagine that the voting enrollment office is 30km from your work/home and that it is only open during work hours. It is likely that poor people/people without a car/etc would not enroll.

pdonis 7y ago

> it would require a huge project to ensure every legal voter had some form of ID Without an ID, how do people at polling places know they're a legal voter? Using the honor system made sense a century or two ago when most people lived all their lives in the same place where they grew up and everyone at the polling place knew everybody. But that's not the case now and hasn't been for a long time. With all the talk about securing our election process against tampering (which I'm all in favor of), if it doesn't include voter ID, it's not secure. > the number of voter fraud incidents is vanishingly small The number of known voter fraud incidents is very small. But if ID isn't required to vote and we just accept people's word when they say they're eligible to vote, how could you ever prove voter fraud?

crooked-v 7y ago
> how could you ever prove voter fraud? There have been expansive studies on the subject, all of which have found incredibly low rates of actual voter fraud (as distinct from clerical errors or mistakenly voting at the wrong precinct): https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/research-reports/debunking-voter-fraud-myth https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/research-reports/debu...
- Vaslo 7y ago
  Far left organization, seems like a fair and unbiased source of information
  - crooked-v 7y ago
    What does that matter? It's a page of links to peer-reviewed studies, legal opinions, and article from major journalism outlets, not an opinion piece.
    - Vaslo 7y ago
      Yes, I'm sure it diligently looked at reviews that were opposite or critical of those studies and decided it would further their cause to list them. Where is the list that refutes this data? Here's a hint, a little searching on Google will show you that there are opposing organizations who, conveniently, leave out this far left website's "legitimate reviews" in favor of ones that follow THEIR side.