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>calling Hong Kong protesters “separatists”, etc. Devil's advocate here...Are they not separatist? If not, shouldn't they be? It's hard to imagine your "coun

>calling Hong Kong protesters “separatists”, etc. Devil's advocate here...Are they not separatist? If not, shouldn't they be? It's hard to imagine your "country" working on a death clock. In 2047 it all ends. So, what is the point of fighting the good fight at this point? Why not face the inevitable and leave while you can? Or fight for a final independence now, while you can?

CharlesColeman 7y ago
> So, what is the point of fighting the good fight at this point? Why not face the inevitable and leave while you can? Or fight for a final independence now, while you can? Because there's still 28 years to go, and a lot can happen in 28 years.
- IanDrake 7y ago
  Thanks for hitting the heart of the matter. A lot can happen in that time. Given the direction of things, do you think it will be better? I guess I don't. When HK is supposed to hand itself over to China's rule in 2047, do you think there will be ANY international support for their independence? I don't. That would be directly against the deal that was struck. Wouldn't it be better to use China's interference as a pretext for independence, claiming it was China who has broken the bargain? American independence wasn't about a tea tax or a few soldiers defending themselves in Boston. It was about inevitability and using those events to propel it.
  - CharlesColeman 7y ago
    > When HK is supposed to hand itself over to China's rule in 2047 In 1982, pretty much everyone assumed the Soviet Union was still going to be around in 1992, but it wasn't. Who knows what China will look like in 2047. A lot can happen in 28 years.
roywiggins 7y ago
> Devil's advocate here...Are they not separatist? If not, shouldn't they be? These are their demands (more or less): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Hong_Kong_protests#Objectives https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Hong_Kong_protests#Object... Full-on separatism would give the PLA a more plausible reason to declare an insurrection and go full Tiananmen Square. Also, a lot of HKers who support the existing demands would not be on board with it.
martythemaniak 7y ago
Well, they have five demands and the most "radical" of them is being able to vote for your own representatives. Being represented in your own government is a far cry from being a separatist. Most separatists are probably protestors, but that does not imply most protestors are separatists.
- Aperocky 7y ago
  Actually, I don't think that's radical at all. It's to stop calling it a riot and release anybody who is arrested because of it. Just because you're rioting for democracy, doesn't mean it's not a riot, and it doesn't grant those who used it as an opportunity to vandalize shops and destroy subways a free pass. That directly conflicts with the rule of law.
- nyolfen 7y ago
  the most radical part about them isn't their formal demands, it's viciously assaulting pedestrians while screaming slurs

CharlesColeman 7y ago

> So, what is the point of fighting the good fight at this point? Why not face the inevitable and leave while you can? Or fight for a final independence now, while you can? Because there's still 28 years to go, and a lot can happen in 28 years.

IanDrake 7y ago
Thanks for hitting the heart of the matter. A lot can happen in that time. Given the direction of things, do you think it will be better? I guess I don't. When HK is supposed to hand itself over to China's rule in 2047, do you think there will be ANY international support for their independence? I don't. That would be directly against the deal that was struck. Wouldn't it be better to use China's interference as a pretext for independence, claiming it was China who has broken the bargain? American independence wasn't about a tea tax or a few soldiers defending themselves in Boston. It was about inevitability and using those events to propel it.
- CharlesColeman 7y ago
  > When HK is supposed to hand itself over to China's rule in 2047 In 1982, pretty much everyone assumed the Soviet Union was still going to be around in 1992, but it wasn't. Who knows what China will look like in 2047. A lot can happen in 28 years.

roywiggins 7y ago

> Devil's advocate here...Are they not separatist? If not, shouldn't they be? These are their demands (more or less): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Hong_Kong_protests#Objectives https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Hong_Kong_protests#Object... Full-on separatism would give the PLA a more plausible reason to declare an insurrection and go full Tiananmen Square. Also, a lot of HKers who support the existing demands would not be on board with it.

martythemaniak 7y ago

Well, they have five demands and the most "radical" of them is being able to vote for your own representatives. Being represented in your own government is a far cry from being a separatist. Most separatists are probably protestors, but that does not imply most protestors are separatists.

Aperocky 7y ago
Actually, I don't think that's radical at all. It's to stop calling it a riot and release anybody who is arrested because of it. Just because you're rioting for democracy, doesn't mean it's not a riot, and it doesn't grant those who used it as an opportunity to vandalize shops and destroy subways a free pass. That directly conflicts with the rule of law.
nyolfen 7y ago
the most radical part about them isn't their formal demands, it's viciously assaulting pedestrians while screaming slurs