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> They were offered free software that would enable them to dodge the Great Firewall of China – which blocks almost all major Western news sites and social medi

> They were offered free software that would enable them to dodge the Great Firewall of China – which blocks almost all major Western news sites and social media outlets – and browse the internet without restrictions. There was some surprise when it turned out that even elite students in China had little interest in finding out what Westerners were thinking. Only 53 per cent of the participants had activated the software (even after repeated reminders), and about 14 per cent of the ones who had activated it uninstalled it shortly afterwards. Active users were browsing content which wasn’t political. If you’re a University student randomly offered “free software” to bypass the firewall of course you’re going to be acutely aware that your activity is still being monitored. Probably monitored even closer than usual. I’m not sure their browsing habits really indicate their interests in that scenario.

yorwba 7y ago
> I’m not sure their browsing habits really indicate their interests in that scenario. You should read the actual study [1] then. E.g. "when news on the Panama Papers broke (the week of April 4th, 2016) and when President Trump called the President of Taiwan (the week of December 5th, 2016) — two of the highest news peaks during the experiment — Group-AE students increased their weekly browsing time on the New York Times by 157% and 180% compared to their average consumption, respectively. Overall, a 10% increase in the share of politically sensitive articles published corresponds to students spending 1.8 more minutes on the website during that week." [1] http://as.nyu.edu/content/dam/nyu-as/econ/documents/2018-fall/1984bravenewworld_draft.pdf http://as.nyu.edu/content/dam/nyu-as/econ/documents/2018-fal... The study (or rather, an article based on the study) was discussed on HN before: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20233268 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20233268
Jommi 7y ago
This is an even bigger joke if you know that residential areas of the 2 biggest Unis in Beijing have built-in VPNs allowing you to access google anyays :)
- baybal2 7y ago
  I know of few Western universities in China giving out VPN on campus from under the table, but nothing like that in BJ. Can you elaborate?
  - jameskegel 7y ago
    What are you doing?
    - baybal2 7y ago
      Working in an manufacturing/engineering consulting shop
  - Jommi 7y ago
    Go to Beijing. Go to one of the two best universities. Go to the residential area. Connect to wifi. Go to google.com. This worked at least 6 months ago and a student active confirmed that its how it has always been.
    - baybal2 7y ago
      Tsinghua? They made some form of VPN just for foreign exchange students as I heard. Never heard of details though.
- yourapostasy 7y ago
  My limited understanding of how this works from reading descriptions by others is any registered organizational entity can apply to the CCP for an organization-wide VPN for approved purposes. But the CCP maintains the right to MITM the VPN and snoop your traffic to their hearts' content. I don't see how they can inspect your traffic in the clear though, without coercing you to install their VPN software in order to use a VPN appliance they supply/approve to forcibly modify your browser to accept their certificates, so I'm confused on just how much they can snoop. So how do these "approved VPN's" really work?
  - 7y ago
theseadroid 7y ago
You might be thinking that the majority of Chinese are constantly under the fear of being monitored. The reality is people don't care and use VPN all the time. You might've heard people get in trouble using VPN in China. Many of you assume that's the norm. At least for now it's not. It would be like people from other countries heard there are shootings in U.S. schools and assume there are shootings in every U.S. school every day.
- elliekelly 7y ago
  Apologies, I wasn’t trying to insinuate the students feared monitoring. For example, when I use the internet at work I’m not afraid of being monitored by my employer but I’m definitely aware that my activity could be monitored. And it does change my behavior to some degree.
pwinnski 7y ago
How much time do westerners spend on the Chinese internet? How much relevance does either set of sites have to someone living in the other hemisphere? I find myself barely-remembering most western sites while I'm in China for even a couple of weeks, and language issues (mostly) keep me from spending much time on Chinese sites while I'm in the USA. Based on my experience as a Westerner making trips to China, I find this VPN anecdote unsurprising.
- solotronics 7y ago
  Every once in a while I baidu search something to see if there are any results that are totally different than on western search engines. I have never heard of any of my friends, coworkers, or family doing this so it's probably really uncommon.
  - silexia 7y ago
    The truth is that censorship is terrifyingly powerful as most people won't work around it. This is why we must be extraordinarily vigilant in defending our freedom and attacking those who would take it away or those who have taken it away in their countries (Communist Party of China which is now a dictatorship). Boycott the NBA and Blizzard and support those such as South Park who fight back

yorwba 7y ago

> I’m not sure their browsing habits really indicate their interests in that scenario. You should read the actual study [1] then. E.g. "when news on the Panama Papers broke (the week of April 4th, 2016) and when President Trump called the President of Taiwan (the week of December 5th, 2016) — two of the highest news peaks during the experiment — Group-AE students increased their weekly browsing time on the New York Times by 157% and 180% compared to their average consumption, respectively. Overall, a 10% increase in the share of politically sensitive articles published corresponds to students spending 1.8 more minutes on the website during that week." [1] http://as.nyu.edu/content/dam/nyu-as/econ/documents/2018-fall/1984bravenewworld_draft.pdf http://as.nyu.edu/content/dam/nyu-as/econ/documents/2018-fal... The study (or rather, an article based on the study) was discussed on HN before: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20233268 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20233268

Jommi 7y ago

This is an even bigger joke if you know that residential areas of the 2 biggest Unis in Beijing have built-in VPNs allowing you to access google anyays :)

baybal2 7y ago
I know of few Western universities in China giving out VPN on campus from under the table, but nothing like that in BJ. Can you elaborate?
- jameskegel 7y ago
  What are you doing?
  - baybal2 7y ago
    Working in an manufacturing/engineering consulting shop
- Jommi 7y ago
  Go to Beijing. Go to one of the two best universities. Go to the residential area. Connect to wifi. Go to google.com. This worked at least 6 months ago and a student active confirmed that its how it has always been.
  - baybal2 7y ago
    Tsinghua? They made some form of VPN just for foreign exchange students as I heard. Never heard of details though.
yourapostasy 7y ago
My limited understanding of how this works from reading descriptions by others is any registered organizational entity can apply to the CCP for an organization-wide VPN for approved purposes. But the CCP maintains the right to MITM the VPN and snoop your traffic to their hearts' content. I don't see how they can inspect your traffic in the clear though, without coercing you to install their VPN software in order to use a VPN appliance they supply/approve to forcibly modify your browser to accept their certificates, so I'm confused on just how much they can snoop. So how do these "approved VPN's" really work?
- 7y ago

theseadroid 7y ago

You might be thinking that the majority of Chinese are constantly under the fear of being monitored. The reality is people don't care and use VPN all the time. You might've heard people get in trouble using VPN in China. Many of you assume that's the norm. At least for now it's not. It would be like people from other countries heard there are shootings in U.S. schools and assume there are shootings in every U.S. school every day.

elliekelly 7y ago
Apologies, I wasn’t trying to insinuate the students feared monitoring. For example, when I use the internet at work I’m not afraid of being monitored by my employer but I’m definitely aware that my activity could be monitored. And it does change my behavior to some degree.

pwinnski 7y ago

How much time do westerners spend on the Chinese internet? How much relevance does either set of sites have to someone living in the other hemisphere? I find myself barely-remembering most western sites while I'm in China for even a couple of weeks, and language issues (mostly) keep me from spending much time on Chinese sites while I'm in the USA. Based on my experience as a Westerner making trips to China, I find this VPN anecdote unsurprising.

solotronics 7y ago
Every once in a while I baidu search something to see if there are any results that are totally different than on western search engines. I have never heard of any of my friends, coworkers, or family doing this so it's probably really uncommon.
- silexia 7y ago
  The truth is that censorship is terrifyingly powerful as most people won't work around it. This is why we must be extraordinarily vigilant in defending our freedom and attacking those who would take it away or those who have taken it away in their countries (Communist Party of China which is now a dictatorship). Boycott the NBA and Blizzard and support those such as South Park who fight back