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>even and especially the very limited, court-approved, kind Unfortunately historical precedents shows this to be false -at least to an important degree- meanin

>even and especially the very limited, court-approved, kind Unfortunately historical precedents shows this to be false -at least to an important degree- meaning this power will be abused and misused: FBI controversies abound[0], from covert operations on political groups (e.g. Martin Luther King) to more recent investigation into misconduct at the DOJ and FBI over its probe of Hillary Clinton's private email server; in the same vein 85.000 law enforcement officers have been investigated in the last decade for misconduct[1], as noteworthy the time the LAPD (Los Angeles Police) helped fuel the crack epidemic[2], or when the FBI mistakenly relied on wrongly classified DNA evidence[3] during 25 years (involving 268 cases), historically some of the strongest racism USA has seen was from the police itself when Harry Anslinger as head of the FBN created the war on marihuana specifically to target black people, famous for saying "This marijuana causes white women to seek sexual relations with Negroes, entertainers and any others."[4] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_FBI_controversies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_FBI_controversies [1] https://www.usatoday.com/in-depth/news/investigations/2019/04/24/usa-today-revealing-misconduct-records-police-cops/3223984002/ https://www.usatoday.com/in-depth/news/investigations/2019/0... [2] https://www.globalresearch.ca/crack-and-the-contras-how-the-cia-mainstream-media-propaganda-and-the-contras-fueled-the-crack-cocaine-epidemic/5629132 https://www.globalresearch.ca/crack-and-the-contras-how-the-... [3] https://www.businessinsider.com/people-may-have-been-wrongfully-executed-because-the-fbi-messed-up-evidence-2015-4 https://www.businessinsider.com/people-may-have-been-wrongfu... [4] https://timeline.com/harry-anslinger-racist-war-on-drugs-prison-industrial-complex-fb5cbc281189 https://timeline.com/harry-anslinger-racist-war-on-drugs-pri...

bayesian_horse 7y ago
No case of abuse of such powers negates the relevance and importance of legally approved surveillance to enforcing laws.
- mattigames 7y ago
  Why not? How much abuse is too much for you? Is there a threshold I can read about and about any logic behind it?
- bayesian_horse 7y ago
  I never claimed there is no abuse. I specifically stated that surveillance, even limited through laws, is essential to most of law enforcement. Transgressions about such limits don't somehow make it untrue that many criminal convictions in all sorts of areas are based upon entirely lawful surveillance. I don't think there is any solid argument society would be safer if all such surveillance was deemed illegal.
  - mattigames 7y ago
    How do you know the abuse from having those new surveillance tools will be lesser than the good they will provide?

bayesian_horse 7y ago

No case of abuse of such powers negates the relevance and importance of legally approved surveillance to enforcing laws.

mattigames 7y ago
Why not? How much abuse is too much for you? Is there a threshold I can read about and about any logic behind it?
bayesian_horse 7y ago
I never claimed there is no abuse. I specifically stated that surveillance, even limited through laws, is essential to most of law enforcement. Transgressions about such limits don't somehow make it untrue that many criminal convictions in all sorts of areas are based upon entirely lawful surveillance. I don't think there is any solid argument society would be safer if all such surveillance was deemed illegal.
- mattigames 7y ago
  How do you know the abuse from having those new surveillance tools will be lesser than the good they will provide?