6 ms·

Shouldn't you calculate it by passenger-time? The car seats 1-3 people, sits in traffic, etc. A passenger BUS probably does a lot more CO2 than a car too...

csharpminor 7y ago
Seat utilization is a big factor here, but let's take the worst case for a car vs. the best case for a helicopter. Assume that the helicopter can make 3 trips per hour (8 minutes flight time, plus 12 minutes turnover). 950 / 3 = 316 lbs of C02 per flight. It looks like the Bell 430 configuration they have has 6 passenger seats, so 52.7 lbs of C02 per passenger. Even if the taxi has only one passenger and takes 1.5 hours to reach JFK in moderate traffic, that rider will only be generating 33 lbs of C02 (37% less C02 than a helicopter in a best-case scenario for the helicopter). Buses do produce more CO2 than cars, but are generally 6-8 times more efficient on a passenger-mile basis.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
_-___________-_ 7y ago
Why is time relevant here? I'd have thought it would be better to compare the CO2 emitted by one heli trip to the airport from central NYC to the CO2 emitted by one taxi trip to the airport from central NYC, in both cases divided by the number of passengers.
rriepe 7y ago
I'm more confused how a helicopter that's 2500 lbs empty can somehow spit out over 900 lbs of emissions every hour for its four hour flight endurance. They've got to be doing some tricky calculations to get there. I'm guessing it looks more like consideration of infrastructure and production than it does passenger-time.
- Zanni 7y ago
  One pound of carbon becomes 3.7 pounds of CO2 "emissions" when it combines with atmospheric oxygen: https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/contentIncludes/co2_inc.htm https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/contentIncludes/co2_inc.htm
  - peter303 7y ago
    One gallon of carbon petroleum fuel weighing 7 pounds becomes 22 pounds of carbon dioxide. Essentially in burning fuel you replace carbon plus two hydrogen atoms- atomic weight 14- with a carbon plus two oxygen atoms- atomic weight 44. That is an increase of 3.14x.
- smilekzs 7y ago
  Well it is also burning oxygen from air which you don't carry on the helicopter. Let me see how much high school chemistry I still remember... CO2 = C (12) * 1 + O (16) * 2 So 1 lb of C from fuel => 3.67 lb of CO2 out Suppose AvGas is just Octane, C8H18 C8H18 = C (12) * 8 + H (1) * 18 1 lb of octane => 0.84 lb of C => 3.09 lb of CO2 So yeah, you get 3 lb CO2 from 1 lb of octane.
- loeg 7y ago
  Air breathing engine.
- jann 7y ago
  It takes fuel (onboard) + oxygen (environment) to create the CO2. I assume that’s where the additional mass comes from.

csharpminor 7y ago

Seat utilization is a big factor here, but let's take the worst case for a car vs. the best case for a helicopter. Assume that the helicopter can make 3 trips per hour (8 minutes flight time, plus 12 minutes turnover). 950 / 3 = 316 lbs of C02 per flight. It looks like the Bell 430 configuration they have has 6 passenger seats, so 52.7 lbs of C02 per passenger. Even if the taxi has only one passenger and takes 1.5 hours to reach JFK in moderate traffic, that rider will only be generating 33 lbs of C02 (37% less C02 than a helicopter in a best-case scenario for the helicopter). Buses do produce more CO2 than cars, but are generally 6-8 times more efficient on a passenger-mile basis.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

_-___________-_ 7y ago

Why is time relevant here? I'd have thought it would be better to compare the CO2 emitted by one heli trip to the airport from central NYC to the CO2 emitted by one taxi trip to the airport from central NYC, in both cases divided by the number of passengers.

rriepe 7y ago

I'm more confused how a helicopter that's 2500 lbs empty can somehow spit out over 900 lbs of emissions every hour for its four hour flight endurance. They've got to be doing some tricky calculations to get there. I'm guessing it looks more like consideration of infrastructure and production than it does passenger-time.

Zanni 7y ago
One pound of carbon becomes 3.7 pounds of CO2 "emissions" when it combines with atmospheric oxygen: https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/contentIncludes/co2_inc.htm https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/contentIncludes/co2_inc.htm
- peter303 7y ago
  One gallon of carbon petroleum fuel weighing 7 pounds becomes 22 pounds of carbon dioxide. Essentially in burning fuel you replace carbon plus two hydrogen atoms- atomic weight 14- with a carbon plus two oxygen atoms- atomic weight 44. That is an increase of 3.14x.
smilekzs 7y ago
Well it is also burning oxygen from air which you don't carry on the helicopter. Let me see how much high school chemistry I still remember... CO2 = C (12) * 1 + O (16) * 2 So 1 lb of C from fuel => 3.67 lb of CO2 out Suppose AvGas is just Octane, C8H18 C8H18 = C (12) * 8 + H (1) * 18 1 lb of octane => 0.84 lb of C => 3.09 lb of CO2 So yeah, you get 3 lb CO2 from 1 lb of octane.
loeg 7y ago
Air breathing engine.
jann 7y ago
It takes fuel (onboard) + oxygen (environment) to create the CO2. I assume that’s where the additional mass comes from.