5 ms·

Is there a TLDR of what happened anywhere?

by moneywoes 7y ago

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
peterkelly 7y ago
Based on GP's link: Controversy over gender pronouns
itake 7y ago
Moderator got fired for wanting to not use pronouns at all, because they though preferred pronouns were confusing to non-native English speakers instead of preferred pronouns.
ALittleLight 7y ago
Seems like there was a disagreement regarding the use of gender pronouns that resulted in 73 moderators getting "fired" or leaving. The author of that summary mentioned one thing I found especially egregious, which is a policy that stated avoiding using pronouns was out of alignment. If I understand correctly, when she asked how they would know if she was avoiding pronouns or just naturally not writing them, she was fired. I may have this wrong as I just skimmed the summary. Also it seems she had multiple disagreements on this front before.
- ShamelessC 7y ago
  Is the implication that the LGBTQ+ community found it _more_ offensive to use e.g. "they" than "he" or "she"? I'm so confused. Wouldn't "they" (the gender neutral version) be _more_ inclusive? Is there some other alternative that's even better that I haven't considered? I hope I'm not offending anyone by asking this. Just trying to make sure I understand.
  - Buge 7y ago
    Monica wanted to write in a way such that she would never use the words "he", "she", or singular "they". Stack Exchange said it's not OK to write in a restricted way like that, the words must be used.
    - jolmg 7y ago
      As I understood it, Stack Exchange didn't say anything. They just fired her for asking.
      - prepend 7y ago
        They said that by firing her.
  - patmcc 7y ago
    Yes, people will often find it offensive if you use "they" after asked to use "he" or "she". If someone says "I am a man, please use he/him for my pronouns" and you use 'they' - that would generally be considered at least odd, if not inappropriate. I don't think that means it's inappropriate to use "they" as the default if no other information exists though.
    - anon12345690 7y ago
      uh but using "they" as a neutral way to talk about anyone is just fine. people have been doing that for literally centuries, its called "singular they" this is all about people wanting to be outraged for no reason
      - patmcc 7y ago
        "Singular they" is indeed well used, but it's not normally used when the gender of the person in question is explicitly known. If you use "they" for someone who has specifically said to you "please use the pronouns 'she/her' when referring to me", you are being rude, not neutral.
        NeedMoreTea 7y ago
        "Where's Dave?" "They're in the garage, I think" is common to hear, just as "He's in the garage, I think" Many will mix between the "he/she" and "they" in the same conversation. Quite often referring to their closest friends and family rather than pointed attempt to misuse a pronoun.
        bmn__ 7y ago
        > ["They"] is common to hear, just as ["He"] > Many will mix between the "he/she" and "they" in the same conversation. That does not match my observed reality at all. All natural languages I know are gendered the same way English is. Singular "they" is already exceedingly uncommon by itself; and across all the languages, and in my whole life-time, never once I or a conversation partner used "they" instead of the specialised pronoun, or mixed in a conversation, when the gender of the person in question is explicitly known as GP wrote. The same is true for all written material I read in my whole life.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- Buge 7y ago
  1 was fired. 73 then left in support of her.

Is there a TLDR of what happened anywhere?

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

peterkelly 7y ago

Based on GP's link: Controversy over gender pronouns

itake 7y ago

Moderator got fired for wanting to not use pronouns at all, because they though preferred pronouns were confusing to non-native English speakers instead of preferred pronouns.

ALittleLight 7y ago

Seems like there was a disagreement regarding the use of gender pronouns that resulted in 73 moderators getting "fired" or leaving. The author of that summary mentioned one thing I found especially egregious, which is a policy that stated avoiding using pronouns was out of alignment. If I understand correctly, when she asked how they would know if she was avoiding pronouns or just naturally not writing them, she was fired. I may have this wrong as I just skimmed the summary. Also it seems she had multiple disagreements on this front before.

ShamelessC 7y ago
Is the implication that the LGBTQ+ community found it _more_ offensive to use e.g. "they" than "he" or "she"? I'm so confused. Wouldn't "they" (the gender neutral version) be _more_ inclusive? Is there some other alternative that's even better that I haven't considered? I hope I'm not offending anyone by asking this. Just trying to make sure I understand.
- Buge 7y ago
  Monica wanted to write in a way such that she would never use the words "he", "she", or singular "they". Stack Exchange said it's not OK to write in a restricted way like that, the words must be used.
  - jolmg 7y ago
    As I understood it, Stack Exchange didn't say anything. They just fired her for asking.
    - prepend 7y ago
      They said that by firing her.
- patmcc 7y ago
  Yes, people will often find it offensive if you use "they" after asked to use "he" or "she". If someone says "I am a man, please use he/him for my pronouns" and you use 'they' - that would generally be considered at least odd, if not inappropriate. I don't think that means it's inappropriate to use "they" as the default if no other information exists though.
  - anon12345690 7y ago
    uh but using "they" as a neutral way to talk about anyone is just fine. people have been doing that for literally centuries, its called "singular they" this is all about people wanting to be outraged for no reason
    - patmcc 7y ago
      "Singular they" is indeed well used, but it's not normally used when the gender of the person in question is explicitly known. If you use "they" for someone who has specifically said to you "please use the pronouns 'she/her' when referring to me", you are being rude, not neutral.
      - NeedMoreTea 7y ago
        "Where's Dave?" "They're in the garage, I think" is common to hear, just as "He's in the garage, I think" Many will mix between the "he/she" and "they" in the same conversation. Quite often referring to their closest friends and family rather than pointed attempt to misuse a pronoun.
        bmn__ 7y ago
        > ["They"] is common to hear, just as ["He"] > Many will mix between the "he/she" and "they" in the same conversation. That does not match my observed reality at all. All natural languages I know are gendered the same way English is. Singular "they" is already exceedingly uncommon by itself; and across all the languages, and in my whole life-time, never once I or a conversation partner used "they" instead of the specialised pronoun, or mixed in a conversation, when the gender of the person in question is explicitly known as GP wrote. The same is true for all written material I read in my whole life.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
Buge 7y ago
1 was fired. 73 then left in support of her.