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I am deeply concerned. The 'luke skywalker' liberal attitudes of the past don't work anymore as a rebellious outcome. You can find a lot of videos online from p

I am deeply concerned. The 'luke skywalker' liberal attitudes of the past don't work anymore as a rebellious outcome. You can find a lot of videos online from politicians stating their aims and values. Across the west authority is going to be the most important thing in the future politically. You can hear many politicians that were successful during the liberal era say this, like australia's pm john howard. There is something deeply wrong about the authoritarian swing we are experiencing. There's a sizeable chunk of the populace complaining they're being suppressed or oppressed and using the attention they gain to form their own filter bubbles where they oppress and suppress thoughts they don't like. Without a second's thought about the double standard. The west's attitude towards valuing freedom as a goal to be achieved is put under a large question mark. Are we even aiming at that anymore? Where do you go to be free? We seem to be aiming at the right to oppress others. Hm I'm not sure about that. I'm trying to figure it out in the sunlight. It seems the only way to be 'free' in the old sense is to be the king of yourself. Willing to throw away everything you could ever have or gain simply to retain authority over your own being. Is the only place left for "the left" to be in exile? Underground and unseen is the only place left to be free? Dodging the spotlight, jailbreaking and refusing orders. Seems like a shitter world than I'd like.

miles 7y ago
> It seems the only way to be 'free' in the old sense is to be the king of yourself. Willing to throw away everything you could ever have or gain simply to retain authority over your own being. You are channeling Epictetus[0]: That is why [Diogenes] used to say, "From the time that Antisthenes set me free, I have ceased to be a slave." How did Antisthenes set him free? Listen to what Diogenes says. "He taught me what was mine, and what was not mine. Property is not mine; kinsmen, members of my household, friends, reputation, familiar places, converse with men—all these are not my own. 'What, then, is yours? Power to deal with external impressions.' He showed me that I possess this beyond all hindrance and constraint; no one can hamper me; no one can force me to deal with them otherwise than as I will. Who, then, has authority over me? Philip, or Alexander, or Perdiccas, or the Great King? Where can they get it? For the man who is destined to be overpowered by a man must long before that have been overpowered by things." Therefore, the man over whom pleasure has no power, nor evil, nor fame, nor wealth, and who, whenever it seems good to him, can spit his whole paltry body into some oppressor's face and depart from this life—whose slave can he any longer be, whose subject? [0] https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page%3ADiscourses_of_Epictetus_volume_2_Oldfather_1928.djvu/217 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page%3ADiscourses_of_Epictetu...
- friendlybus 7y ago
  Interesting. With this recent resurgence of Hitler/Stalin stuff (that is basically gone now) it seems the last time we went through an authoritarian phase there was a whole host of problems with the surrounding ideas and the implementation of it. The most recent speaker of note on it went on to talk about how he thinks the only solution this time round is to be individualist masters of our own house. Many people agree with that idea. That speaker was likely influenced by Epictetus too, and the Greeks in general. We are all individually doomed to stand and burn in the sunlight, as a hierarchy of authority forms around us. But this is only half the equation. In the past the exiled half was a matter of flesh and assumed racial identity. We aren't doing that again. But what is the exiled status? An individual that says no to authority? What is the core problem with somebody who does not bend to our current wave of authoritarianism? How do we harness this power for good? It would be trivial to f* it up. Give past dictators the power of tagging & labeling in a secret worldwide internet database that contains everybody's face & data and the world becomes very dark very quickly. We must figure out what we are fighting to protect before it's gone forever.
desc 7y ago
It's not as simple as left vs. right. Authoritarianism can build a power base on either. Those who reject authoritarianism still have the paradox of tolerance and tyranny of the minority to deal with. Those who band together have more power than individuals. Those who use their power to gain more followers gain more power. Eventually it doesn't really matter what they're selling, because absent any other forces, the majority will buy it. What needs fixing is human nature on a majority scale, and no one's figured out how to do that. It's a bit like geoengineering: we can hack it a bit in the short term, but the longer-term consequences are still beyond our comprehension/attention span. And besides, whose 'fix' would we trust... 'Be excellent towards one another' is probably the best guidance we'll get. Enforcing that? Well, then we need definitions and rules and people exploiting them.

miles 7y ago

> It seems the only way to be 'free' in the old sense is to be the king of yourself. Willing to throw away everything you could ever have or gain simply to retain authority over your own being. You are channeling Epictetus[0]: That is why [Diogenes] used to say, "From the time that Antisthenes set me free, I have ceased to be a slave." How did Antisthenes set him free? Listen to what Diogenes says. "He taught me what was mine, and what was not mine. Property is not mine; kinsmen, members of my household, friends, reputation, familiar places, converse with men—all these are not my own. 'What, then, is yours? Power to deal with external impressions.' He showed me that I possess this beyond all hindrance and constraint; no one can hamper me; no one can force me to deal with them otherwise than as I will. Who, then, has authority over me? Philip, or Alexander, or Perdiccas, or the Great King? Where can they get it? For the man who is destined to be overpowered by a man must long before that have been overpowered by things." Therefore, the man over whom pleasure has no power, nor evil, nor fame, nor wealth, and who, whenever it seems good to him, can spit his whole paltry body into some oppressor's face and depart from this life—whose slave can he any longer be, whose subject? [0] https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page%3ADiscourses_of_Epictetus_volume_2_Oldfather_1928.djvu/217 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page%3ADiscourses_of_Epictetu...

friendlybus 7y ago
Interesting. With this recent resurgence of Hitler/Stalin stuff (that is basically gone now) it seems the last time we went through an authoritarian phase there was a whole host of problems with the surrounding ideas and the implementation of it. The most recent speaker of note on it went on to talk about how he thinks the only solution this time round is to be individualist masters of our own house. Many people agree with that idea. That speaker was likely influenced by Epictetus too, and the Greeks in general. We are all individually doomed to stand and burn in the sunlight, as a hierarchy of authority forms around us. But this is only half the equation. In the past the exiled half was a matter of flesh and assumed racial identity. We aren't doing that again. But what is the exiled status? An individual that says no to authority? What is the core problem with somebody who does not bend to our current wave of authoritarianism? How do we harness this power for good? It would be trivial to f* it up. Give past dictators the power of tagging & labeling in a secret worldwide internet database that contains everybody's face & data and the world becomes very dark very quickly. We must figure out what we are fighting to protect before it's gone forever.

desc 7y ago

It's not as simple as left vs. right. Authoritarianism can build a power base on either. Those who reject authoritarianism still have the paradox of tolerance and tyranny of the minority to deal with. Those who band together have more power than individuals. Those who use their power to gain more followers gain more power. Eventually it doesn't really matter what they're selling, because absent any other forces, the majority will buy it. What needs fixing is human nature on a majority scale, and no one's figured out how to do that. It's a bit like geoengineering: we can hack it a bit in the short term, but the longer-term consequences are still beyond our comprehension/attention span. And besides, whose 'fix' would we trust... 'Be excellent towards one another' is probably the best guidance we'll get. Enforcing that? Well, then we need definitions and rules and people exploiting them.