3 ms·

I think you'll have a much harder time convincing women to not base sexual selection, at least in part, on resource gathering. That's pretty ingrained, and not

I think you'll have a much harder time convincing women to not base sexual selection, at least in part, on resource gathering. That's pretty ingrained, and not just culture.

swagasaurus-rex 7y ago
Then men will continue trying, as they have since time immemorial.
- Consultant32452 7y ago
  Exactly. A cultural change is big, but this is even bigger than culture, it's hard wired in our genes since before humans even became a species. So there will never be a magical fairy land where people just accept equal economic outcomes gifted to us by the robots. So we have to start there and figure out a different solution, the suggested solution is a nonstarter.
chillacy 7y ago
Not sure I follow, what does this have to do with meaning and work? And even in a post-scarcity society, some things (like attention and social status) will always be valuable.
- Consultant32452 7y ago
  The whole discussion is built on a fantasy socialist utopia where the robots do all the work and we just issue everyone a paycheck to not work. Socialists have been singing this song since the beginning of socialism. It will never work because it doesn't match with human nature. Some kind of work must be found, and people will demand differential outcomes based on that work. People will destroy the robots before they let this socialist u/dys-topia come to fruition.
  - chillacy 7y ago
    Well people will always "work", but I think the nature of what we consider "work" and "outcomes" might be different. In our current scenario "work" is generate economic value, and "outcome" is dollars. In another scenario "work" could be stories / media, and "outcomes" could be attention. In another, "work" is playing video games, "outcome" is level. In all these scenarios you have people feeling the dopamine and at some level deriving satisfaction. It seems a bit dystopian (and anti-social) even to me, but if we're just talking about "human limitations on society" then I don't see why it couldn't be the case. If we really lived in a post-scarcity world like The Culture, I'd imagine we'd have to evolve how we think about "work" and "outcome" in the same way that most of us no longer "work" for the glory of god for an "outcome" in the afterlife.
    - Consultant32452 7y ago
      >post-scarcity world Well, we don't live in a fictional world. We live in a real world.

I think you'll have a much harder time convincing women to not base sexual selection, at least in part, on resource gathering. That's pretty ingrained, and not just culture.

swagasaurus-rex 7y ago

Then men will continue trying, as they have since time immemorial.

Consultant32452 7y ago
Exactly. A cultural change is big, but this is even bigger than culture, it's hard wired in our genes since before humans even became a species. So there will never be a magical fairy land where people just accept equal economic outcomes gifted to us by the robots. So we have to start there and figure out a different solution, the suggested solution is a nonstarter.

chillacy 7y ago

Not sure I follow, what does this have to do with meaning and work? And even in a post-scarcity society, some things (like attention and social status) will always be valuable.

Consultant32452 7y ago
The whole discussion is built on a fantasy socialist utopia where the robots do all the work and we just issue everyone a paycheck to not work. Socialists have been singing this song since the beginning of socialism. It will never work because it doesn't match with human nature. Some kind of work must be found, and people will demand differential outcomes based on that work. People will destroy the robots before they let this socialist u/dys-topia come to fruition.
- chillacy 7y ago
  Well people will always "work", but I think the nature of what we consider "work" and "outcomes" might be different. In our current scenario "work" is generate economic value, and "outcome" is dollars. In another scenario "work" could be stories / media, and "outcomes" could be attention. In another, "work" is playing video games, "outcome" is level. In all these scenarios you have people feeling the dopamine and at some level deriving satisfaction. It seems a bit dystopian (and anti-social) even to me, but if we're just talking about "human limitations on society" then I don't see why it couldn't be the case. If we really lived in a post-scarcity world like The Culture, I'd imagine we'd have to evolve how we think about "work" and "outcome" in the same way that most of us no longer "work" for the glory of god for an "outcome" in the afterlife.
  - Consultant32452 7y ago
    >post-scarcity world Well, we don't live in a fictional world. We live in a real world.