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Why do exclusive wines fetch several hundred a bottle when in double blind tasting tests oenologists fail to differentiate them from 6€ supermarket wine? Why d

Why do exclusive wines fetch several hundred a bottle when in double blind tasting tests oenologists fail to differentiate them from 6€ supermarket wine? Why does the same Malaysia made shirt go up in price 50x if it gets a top brand label attached a opposed to a cheap generic brand one?

jhrmnn 7y ago
Because the price is not related to functional utility. Auctions do not remove that, btw. See art market.
flr03 7y ago
I doubt what you say about wine. Wine tasting is extremely complex and some experts might not be as near as good as they think they are. But an expensive aged Bordeaux will not taste like a cheap random 6€ supermarket bottle. Also, taste is just one criteria on the price, rarity plays a big part (some vineyards are small, some years the production is smaller), the wine ageing potential is another criteria etc.
- PeterStuer 7y ago
  Some references: "Expensive and inexpensive wines taste the same, research shows" https://phys.org/news/2011-04-expensive-inexpensive-wines.html https://phys.org/news/2011-04-expensive-inexpensive-wines.ht... "The Color of Odors" (add red food coloring to a white wine and tasters think it is a red wine) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11712849 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11712849 "Expensive wine and cheap plonk taste the same to most people" https://www.theguardian.com/science/2011/apr/14/expensive-wine-cheap-plonk-taste https://www.theguardian.com/science/2011/apr/14/expensive-wi... For those interested there is an actual "Journal of Wine Economics" https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-wine-economics https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-wine-econ...
  - flr03 7y ago
    Thank you for your references, but you are missing the point. Neither of your link actually contradict my statement, if your read the article beyond the click bait. Two of them are about classifying the wine from cheap to expensive, which makes no sense because the price doesn't mean the wine taste better, taste is actually subjective first of all and the price does not only depend on the taste anyway as I explained before. Giving a rank to wines or saying that they are different is actually an immense difference in term of logic. The one about colours is not relevant either. It states that people are influenced by the colour and dismiss the odour. Being able to distinguish similar wines in taste is very difficult, regardless of the price and wine colour. It takes an expert to do it because of the shear number of flavours. Even expert can be fouled when wine are close. I wish you had the opportunity to try a nice aged Bordeaux one day you'll get my point. For most people all bread are the same, all rice tastes the same, truth is if you are into this kind of food you are able to tell them apart.
dubcanada 7y ago
Why does the same Malaysia made shirt go up in price 50x if it gets a top brand label attached a opposed to a cheap generic brand one? This one seems like a stretch. Top brands have a level of quality that is much different than a random Walmart brand. When you get to the differences between a $100 shirt and a $1000 shirt is when you stop finding a large difference. But there is usually a vast difference between a $5 shirt and a $50 one. QA of the shirt, material, quality of the sewing, quality of the printing, type of ink, things like shirt hangers, environment friendly material, fit, type of pattern, etc.
- TrackerFF 7y ago
  I'd say that when you're buying a $1000 t-shirt, there are around 3 different options: 1) High-fashion brand item. This is usually a middle-of-the-road item with steep designer markup. Gucci, Tom Ford, etc. 2) Collector item. It could be a $5 shirt which has suddenly become very expensive due to collection-value. Supreme, etc. 3) Hand-made small scale luxury brand item, using rare materials (Vicuña blends, extremely fine wools, etc.). They still have a markup, but more justified than those in 1). Loro Piana, Stefano Ricci, etc.
- PeterStuer 7y ago
  Brands also make a nice side profit licensing their designs an labels to cheap factories that specifically produce for outlet stores. Most of the top brand clothes you buy at these stores (estimated at 85%) are not the original brand clothes from things like leftover stock, but are specifically produced using lower quality materials and processes for outlets. They are not 'fake' in the sense that these are not 'pirated' goods. They legitimately license the designs and branding, but in terms of 'quality' they are miles away from the 'real' thing people think they are buying. So I'm not saying your top brand high-street shirt is the same as a cheap Malaysian produced for private labeling, I'm saying your Outlet sourced top brand one has a very high chance of being close.

jhrmnn 7y ago

Because the price is not related to functional utility. Auctions do not remove that, btw. See art market.

flr03 7y ago

I doubt what you say about wine. Wine tasting is extremely complex and some experts might not be as near as good as they think they are. But an expensive aged Bordeaux will not taste like a cheap random 6€ supermarket bottle. Also, taste is just one criteria on the price, rarity plays a big part (some vineyards are small, some years the production is smaller), the wine ageing potential is another criteria etc.

PeterStuer 7y ago
Some references: "Expensive and inexpensive wines taste the same, research shows" https://phys.org/news/2011-04-expensive-inexpensive-wines.html https://phys.org/news/2011-04-expensive-inexpensive-wines.ht... "The Color of Odors" (add red food coloring to a white wine and tasters think it is a red wine) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11712849 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11712849 "Expensive wine and cheap plonk taste the same to most people" https://www.theguardian.com/science/2011/apr/14/expensive-wine-cheap-plonk-taste https://www.theguardian.com/science/2011/apr/14/expensive-wi... For those interested there is an actual "Journal of Wine Economics" https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-wine-economics https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-wine-econ...
- flr03 7y ago
  Thank you for your references, but you are missing the point. Neither of your link actually contradict my statement, if your read the article beyond the click bait. Two of them are about classifying the wine from cheap to expensive, which makes no sense because the price doesn't mean the wine taste better, taste is actually subjective first of all and the price does not only depend on the taste anyway as I explained before. Giving a rank to wines or saying that they are different is actually an immense difference in term of logic. The one about colours is not relevant either. It states that people are influenced by the colour and dismiss the odour. Being able to distinguish similar wines in taste is very difficult, regardless of the price and wine colour. It takes an expert to do it because of the shear number of flavours. Even expert can be fouled when wine are close. I wish you had the opportunity to try a nice aged Bordeaux one day you'll get my point. For most people all bread are the same, all rice tastes the same, truth is if you are into this kind of food you are able to tell them apart.

dubcanada 7y ago

Why does the same Malaysia made shirt go up in price 50x if it gets a top brand label attached a opposed to a cheap generic brand one? This one seems like a stretch. Top brands have a level of quality that is much different than a random Walmart brand. When you get to the differences between a $100 shirt and a $1000 shirt is when you stop finding a large difference. But there is usually a vast difference between a $5 shirt and a $50 one. QA of the shirt, material, quality of the sewing, quality of the printing, type of ink, things like shirt hangers, environment friendly material, fit, type of pattern, etc.

TrackerFF 7y ago
I'd say that when you're buying a $1000 t-shirt, there are around 3 different options: 1) High-fashion brand item. This is usually a middle-of-the-road item with steep designer markup. Gucci, Tom Ford, etc. 2) Collector item. It could be a $5 shirt which has suddenly become very expensive due to collection-value. Supreme, etc. 3) Hand-made small scale luxury brand item, using rare materials (Vicuña blends, extremely fine wools, etc.). They still have a markup, but more justified than those in 1). Loro Piana, Stefano Ricci, etc.
PeterStuer 7y ago
Brands also make a nice side profit licensing their designs an labels to cheap factories that specifically produce for outlet stores. Most of the top brand clothes you buy at these stores (estimated at 85%) are not the original brand clothes from things like leftover stock, but are specifically produced using lower quality materials and processes for outlets. They are not 'fake' in the sense that these are not 'pirated' goods. They legitimately license the designs and branding, but in terms of 'quality' they are miles away from the 'real' thing people think they are buying. So I'm not saying your top brand high-street shirt is the same as a cheap Malaysian produced for private labeling, I'm saying your Outlet sourced top brand one has a very high chance of being close.