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How many elections have you voted in or been eligible to vote in where a single vote being added or removed would have changed the outcome? Zero? Cool, me too.

How many elections have you voted in or been eligible to vote in where a single vote being added or removed would have changed the outcome? Zero? Cool, me too. Voting is not economically rational if it takes more than zero time, given those odds. When so many people beat the drum of economic rationality, is it a surprise people don't vote? At most one of "economic rationality is valid" or "you should vote" is a true statement. When we're told that the former is true, we're being told not to vote. There are modifications of "rationality" that actually provide a justification for voting. But you'll never see an economist acknowledge that superrationality is a thing, for instance.

ycombobreaker 7y ago
Voting is a civic duty for a functional democracy. I don't understand the rampant defeatism I see in the "deliberate nonvoting" bloc, but the outcome seems obvious enough.
chucksmash 7y ago
> How many elections have you voted in or been eligible to vote in where a single vote being added or removed would have changed the outcome? Zero? Cool, me too. So if you aren't the one, single deciding vote it's not worthwhile? That's an immature approach. All the more immature because you go on to couch it in rhetoric about economics and "rationality" that amounts to nothing more than third rate sophistry. You're not a taxi cab that has to be in service 24 hours a day to maximize utilization. You're a person with responsibilities. Your "economic rationality" is just a lazy justification for only doing what you feel like doing ("provides marginal value!") and never doing anything you don't. If you're going to be a bum, be honest with yourself and those around you.
PhasmaFelis 7y ago
> How many elections have you voted in or been eligible to vote in where a single vote being added or removed would have changed the outcome? Zero? Cool, me too. Is a thing only worth doing if you can cast yourself as the lone hero who turned the tide? This seems like the Tragedy of the Commons. You fish in a stream, because why not? One person can never eat enough fish to make a dent in the population. Then a thousand of your neighbors fish the same stream. Soon it's completely depopulated, and there are no more fish for anyone, and everyone involved can still say "it wasn't my fault, my impact was barely noticeable." Either it's nobody's fault, just a totally unavoidable act of God, or it's everybody's fault, and you all should have worked together to address it. Only one of those ways of thinking will get anything done.
philipkglass 7y ago
I have voted in every election I could since I turned 18. In one of those elections, my preferred candidate won by a mere 129 votes out of 2.8 million votes cast: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Washington_gubernatorial_election https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Washington_gubernatorial_... If you don't vote, you won't be able to tell if your vote "really mattered" in an election until it's too late to do anything.

ycombobreaker 7y ago

Voting is a civic duty for a functional democracy. I don't understand the rampant defeatism I see in the "deliberate nonvoting" bloc, but the outcome seems obvious enough.

chucksmash 7y ago

> How many elections have you voted in or been eligible to vote in where a single vote being added or removed would have changed the outcome? Zero? Cool, me too. So if you aren't the one, single deciding vote it's not worthwhile? That's an immature approach. All the more immature because you go on to couch it in rhetoric about economics and "rationality" that amounts to nothing more than third rate sophistry. You're not a taxi cab that has to be in service 24 hours a day to maximize utilization. You're a person with responsibilities. Your "economic rationality" is just a lazy justification for only doing what you feel like doing ("provides marginal value!") and never doing anything you don't. If you're going to be a bum, be honest with yourself and those around you.

PhasmaFelis 7y ago

> How many elections have you voted in or been eligible to vote in where a single vote being added or removed would have changed the outcome? Zero? Cool, me too. Is a thing only worth doing if you can cast yourself as the lone hero who turned the tide? This seems like the Tragedy of the Commons. You fish in a stream, because why not? One person can never eat enough fish to make a dent in the population. Then a thousand of your neighbors fish the same stream. Soon it's completely depopulated, and there are no more fish for anyone, and everyone involved can still say "it wasn't my fault, my impact was barely noticeable." Either it's nobody's fault, just a totally unavoidable act of God, or it's everybody's fault, and you all should have worked together to address it. Only one of those ways of thinking will get anything done.

philipkglass 7y ago

I have voted in every election I could since I turned 18. In one of those elections, my preferred candidate won by a mere 129 votes out of 2.8 million votes cast: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Washington_gubernatorial_election https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Washington_gubernatorial_... If you don't vote, you won't be able to tell if your vote "really mattered" in an election until it's too late to do anything.