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China is not doing anything new to take away freedom in Hong Kong. To expand on whoevercares' comment, recently someone committed a crime in Taiwan and fled t

China is not doing anything new to take away freedom in Hong Kong. To expand on whoevercares' comment, recently someone committed a crime in Taiwan and fled to Hong Kong. To close this loophole and prevent HK from becoming a safe haven for criminals, the Chief Executive of HK proposed a new law to facilitate extradition of these crime suspects from HK to various jurisdictions in the region, including Taiwan and mainland China. The proposed law even explicitly stated that it's not applicably to crimes political in nature. But some HK people were nevertheless concerned that it might be abused by China to target political dissidents taking refuge in HK. So they have taken to the streets to protest that law. As a result, the law was quickly suspended before it had a chance to pass, and a few weeks ago the HK Chief Executive officially announced the withdrawal of the law. However, despite the concession from the HK government, the protesters pressed on, demanding four more concessions from the government, chief among them universal suffrage, or the direct election of the HK Chief Executive, who up to this point have been nominated from a narrow pool of Beijing-approved candidates, then voted on by a committee. It's not entirely clear that China even had anything to do with the proposal of the law which started this ordeal. But the protesters have shrewdly painted a picture, to great effect, of big bad China stomping on the poor helpless people of HK. (EDIT: spelling, wording)

20190820234322 7y ago
Just a heads-up, this poster is almost certainly a Chinese shill. Just look at his comment history. Sadly, judging from dang's reply to one of his comments from 2 days ago, it looks like he's either been compromised or misinformed about the issue to an simply inexplicable extent. Maybe it's time for him to step down.
lazerpants 7y ago
>or the direct election of the HK Chief Executive, who up to this point have been nominated from a narrow pool of Beijing-approved candidates This is only true since the handover from the UK in 1997.
- UIZealot 7y ago
  That's true. Prior to the handover, the executive head of HK had been the governor, appointed by the British government.
  - lacampbell 7y ago
    Communist China issued invasion threats when the UK proposed introducing self-government in the late 50s and early 60s. https://qz.com/279013/the-secret-history-of-hong-kongs-stillborn-democracy/ https://qz.com/279013/the-secret-history-of-hong-kongs-still...
    - UIZealot 7y ago
      Thank you! That's an interesting read. Directly from the article: > And when Mao founded the People’s Republic of China in 1949, he and Zhou Enlai decided not to seize Hong Kong—which the British at the time expected The other side of the story is that China could've easily seized HK from the beginning, and the people of HK would've been under the direct rule of China, and never gotten any of the freedom and autonomy they enjoy today.
lacampbell 7y ago
To expand on whoevercares' comment, recently someone committed a crime in Taiwan and fled to Hong Kong. To close this loophole and prevent HK from becoming a safe haven for criminals, the Chief Executive of HK proposed a new law to facilitate extradition of these crime suspects from HK to various jurisdictions in the region, including Taiwan and mainland China. Countries without extradition treaties can still extradite criminals on a case by case basis. It was also very cheeky of them to use a criminal from Taiwan R.O.C - a democratic nation with a strong rule of law - as an excuse for an extradition treaty with the Mainland Area of China, a communist dictatorship where laws are at the whims of party members.
- UIZealot 7y ago
  > Countries without extradition treaties can still extradite criminals on a case by case basis. That doesn't seem to be true in this particular case, since said suspect is still enjoying his freedom in HK. An extradition treaty to cover the case seems like a reasonable initiative. > Mainland Area of China, a communist dictatorship where laws are at the whims of party members. I agree that's a valid concern, and that the proposed law didn't include adequate protection for HK citizens. And I support the initial peaceful protests against that law. What I cannot support however, are the ongoing and escalating violence from some of those protesters, before and especially after, the announcement of withdrawal of that law.
- FooBarWidget 7y ago
  You think the HK extradition treaty will be abused by China. China already has an extradition treaty with Taiwan, and has had it for years now. With Taiwan of all places. What does that tell us? None exists between China and HK. And the murderer is still at large.
  - lacampbell 7y ago
    There is no extradition treaty between Taiwan and China. https://www.mac.gov.tw/en/cp.aspx?n=FD37619195CF6DA5&s=CED288DC9B1EC576 https://www.mac.gov.tw/en/cp.aspx?n=FD37619195CF6DA5&s=CED28... You are probably thinking of this. It's not an extradition treaty. It's also now widely ignored.

20190820234322 7y ago

Just a heads-up, this poster is almost certainly a Chinese shill. Just look at his comment history. Sadly, judging from dang's reply to one of his comments from 2 days ago, it looks like he's either been compromised or misinformed about the issue to an simply inexplicable extent. Maybe it's time for him to step down.

lazerpants 7y ago

>or the direct election of the HK Chief Executive, who up to this point have been nominated from a narrow pool of Beijing-approved candidates This is only true since the handover from the UK in 1997.

UIZealot 7y ago
That's true. Prior to the handover, the executive head of HK had been the governor, appointed by the British government.
- lacampbell 7y ago
  Communist China issued invasion threats when the UK proposed introducing self-government in the late 50s and early 60s. https://qz.com/279013/the-secret-history-of-hong-kongs-stillborn-democracy/ https://qz.com/279013/the-secret-history-of-hong-kongs-still...
  - UIZealot 7y ago
    Thank you! That's an interesting read. Directly from the article: > And when Mao founded the People’s Republic of China in 1949, he and Zhou Enlai decided not to seize Hong Kong—which the British at the time expected The other side of the story is that China could've easily seized HK from the beginning, and the people of HK would've been under the direct rule of China, and never gotten any of the freedom and autonomy they enjoy today.

lacampbell 7y ago

To expand on whoevercares' comment, recently someone committed a crime in Taiwan and fled to Hong Kong. To close this loophole and prevent HK from becoming a safe haven for criminals, the Chief Executive of HK proposed a new law to facilitate extradition of these crime suspects from HK to various jurisdictions in the region, including Taiwan and mainland China. Countries without extradition treaties can still extradite criminals on a case by case basis. It was also very cheeky of them to use a criminal from Taiwan R.O.C - a democratic nation with a strong rule of law - as an excuse for an extradition treaty with the Mainland Area of China, a communist dictatorship where laws are at the whims of party members.

UIZealot 7y ago
> Countries without extradition treaties can still extradite criminals on a case by case basis. That doesn't seem to be true in this particular case, since said suspect is still enjoying his freedom in HK. An extradition treaty to cover the case seems like a reasonable initiative. > Mainland Area of China, a communist dictatorship where laws are at the whims of party members. I agree that's a valid concern, and that the proposed law didn't include adequate protection for HK citizens. And I support the initial peaceful protests against that law. What I cannot support however, are the ongoing and escalating violence from some of those protesters, before and especially after, the announcement of withdrawal of that law.
FooBarWidget 7y ago
You think the HK extradition treaty will be abused by China. China already has an extradition treaty with Taiwan, and has had it for years now. With Taiwan of all places. What does that tell us? None exists between China and HK. And the murderer is still at large.
- lacampbell 7y ago
  There is no extradition treaty between Taiwan and China. https://www.mac.gov.tw/en/cp.aspx?n=FD37619195CF6DA5&s=CED288DC9B1EC576 https://www.mac.gov.tw/en/cp.aspx?n=FD37619195CF6DA5&s=CED28... You are probably thinking of this. It's not an extradition treaty. It's also now widely ignored.