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"I do not understand how apple users put up with this" You do not understand because lots of apple users clearly have different usage requirements for their ph

"I do not understand how apple users put up with this" You do not understand because lots of apple users clearly have different usage requirements for their phones. I tinker with stuff 8+ hours per day for a paycheck; when I'm using my phone, I don't want to tinker with it, I want it to just work, and my iPhone does exactly that. Someone has made a bunch of intelligent design decisions about the way things work— much better than with android phones— and I agree with them often enough that I don't care that I can't change them. My brain is busy; the fact that I don't have to think about changing them is great. It's an appliance to me. I don't try to reprogram any of my electronic kitchen appliances either, and I'm a software developer that used to be a chef. I'd much rather spend my time concentrating on the output than the tools. I get that it's not everybody's workflow— you do you. I also really don't care if I can't install apps that aren't available through the app store. I use a teeny, tiny fraction of what is available through the app store... the chance of app store availability being a limiting factor in my phone usage is pretty much non-existent. I use a computer for everything I can't use my phone for, and it's usually better for those tasks, anyway.

guelo 7y ago
You're an obedient citizen that sees no need to go outside the box. China would have no problem with you.
- chefandy 7y ago
  The fact that you think you can intuit that based solely on a brief description of how I interact with my phone indicates that a) phones probably play a much more significant role in your life than mine, and b) your ability to extrapolate people's behavior based on limited information isn't quite as impressive as you think it is.
  - lamigra_burner 7y ago
    The whole point is that phones are playing "a much more significant role" in the protesters lives than yours. You live in a place where you don't have to worry about that, but what does that have to do with the article??
- dang 7y ago
  Personal attacks will get you banned on HN. We've warned you about this multiple times before. Please don't do it again. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - guelo 7y ago
    Ok. I shouldn't have made it personal. I won't do it again.
nimajneb 7y ago
All my Android phones 'have just worked'.
- chefandy 7y ago
  All of mine just didn't. I had to install alternate mail clients, alternate messaging clients, alternate web browsers, etc. etc. etc. The defaults looked terrible and were absolutely non-intuitive. With Apple I get a consistent, well designed interface consistently across any of their devices I purchase. Replace the phone? Don't have to think about it. Just sign in.
  - 0xcafecafe 7y ago
    Same thing applies to me and my google branded phones (first nexus, now pixel). Just sign in after changing the phone and works like a charm.
- Taylor_OD 7y ago
  +1 for having no issues with android phones thus far. I've switched back and forth between android and ios/apple phones and while my apple phones would start great it would take them a year or so before they were almost useless. Plus my headhpones just work in my android phones.
  - chefandy 7y ago
    Admittedly, the headphone jack thing on iPhones is f'ing BS. I hate it. Just give me the damned headphone jack, Apple.
    - hnspirit 7y ago
      4m of water-resistance or a headphone jack. The choice is yours! (I'm ok with the dongle)
    - pmarreck 7y ago
      I have Airpods and a set of Sony bluetooth noise-cancelling cans and I do not miss a corded headphone whatsoever, I don’t get what the big deal is here
tuukkah 7y ago
> [W]hen I'm using my phone, I don't want to tinker with it, I want it to just work, and my iPhone does exactly that. Someone has made a bunch of intelligent design decisions about the way things work— much better than with android phones— So you consider an iPhone works so much better and its design is so much better than Android phones that you allow Apple to choose what you can install? I hope you never end in a situation like in Hong Kong where freedom matters more than design.
- Analemma_ 7y ago
  If you think the fact that your phone runs Android is going to save you if and when the government crackdown comes, I have some bad news for you.
  - retpirato 7y ago
    you realize android has custom ROMs, right? IOS doesn't.
- gbanfalvi 7y ago
  > So you consider an iPhone works so much better and its design is so much better than Android phones that you allow Apple to choose what you can install? Yeah. Lots of people do. Giving up control means a lot, I get it. However I give up control with loads of devices, appliances and services every day. In exchange I expect my iPhone, my gmail account and my Samsung TV to make my life easier. They (hopefully) can’t read my mind, so my choices will always lie on a spectrum between: Taking all control, but having to do all the work myself vs. giving up control (and risk being betrayed) but not having to do the work. > I hope you never end in a situation like in Hong Kong where freedom matters more than design. Absolutely, but I wouldn’t trust most alternatives out there either. I honestly don’t know what I’d do in that case.
- hoi 7y ago
  Actually, it's a trade off. How much freedom vs how much control. A prime example is government regulators, they are there to 'protect ' consumers vs pure freedom of capital ventures. Pure unadulterated freedom never exists because one persons freedom can trample on another persons, e.g the freedom to be racist
brianpgordon 7y ago
I worry about the legacy we're leaving gen Z, and all of the people just coming online in developed countries, for whom mobile is their native computing environment. We can put our phones away and retreat to our "real computers" to scratch our tinkering itch, but that's not accessible or appealing to everyone. When I was a kid, just clicking all the things opened up new vistas of topics to explore, like clicking "view source" in Netscape Navigator leading to getting a book to learn about HTML. There's no "view source" option in Chrome or Safari for mobile.
ActorNightly 7y ago
There is no tinkering with android phones, not sure if you have ever used one.
- jfim 7y ago
  Can you elaborate on that? Many Android phones can have their bootloader unlocked, allow installing alternate operating systems, have alternate app stores, and allow sideloading of applications.
  - fivefive55 7y ago
    Can being the keyword. None of that is even close to required. You have the option to tinker, you aren't required to.
  - mrguyorama 7y ago
    100% of that is optional and entirely unused by most people, excepting maybe a single side-loaded app if they actually care about certain things. This is of course scoped to here in the US, where most of the time Android phones have their OS entirely locked down apart from sideloading apps, ie no running different ROMs, upgrading out of what you're allowed by the network, rooting, running super user apps, etc
- retpirato 7y ago
  what planet are you living on? you can install custom launchers,dialers,sms, third-party app stores, & pretty much whatever else even without root or flashing a ROM. Not to mention the ability to sideload apps. The sky is the limit with root. There's widgets too, something completely foreign to isheep. There is plenty of tinkering available on android.
  - ActorNightly 7y ago
    I meant in the sense of setting it up initially.

guelo 7y ago

You're an obedient citizen that sees no need to go outside the box. China would have no problem with you.

chefandy 7y ago
The fact that you think you can intuit that based solely on a brief description of how I interact with my phone indicates that a) phones probably play a much more significant role in your life than mine, and b) your ability to extrapolate people's behavior based on limited information isn't quite as impressive as you think it is.
- lamigra_burner 7y ago
  The whole point is that phones are playing "a much more significant role" in the protesters lives than yours. You live in a place where you don't have to worry about that, but what does that have to do with the article??
dang 7y ago
Personal attacks will get you banned on HN. We've warned you about this multiple times before. Please don't do it again. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- guelo 7y ago
  Ok. I shouldn't have made it personal. I won't do it again.

nimajneb 7y ago

All my Android phones 'have just worked'.

chefandy 7y ago
All of mine just didn't. I had to install alternate mail clients, alternate messaging clients, alternate web browsers, etc. etc. etc. The defaults looked terrible and were absolutely non-intuitive. With Apple I get a consistent, well designed interface consistently across any of their devices I purchase. Replace the phone? Don't have to think about it. Just sign in.
- 0xcafecafe 7y ago
  Same thing applies to me and my google branded phones (first nexus, now pixel). Just sign in after changing the phone and works like a charm.
Taylor_OD 7y ago
+1 for having no issues with android phones thus far. I've switched back and forth between android and ios/apple phones and while my apple phones would start great it would take them a year or so before they were almost useless. Plus my headhpones just work in my android phones.
- chefandy 7y ago
  Admittedly, the headphone jack thing on iPhones is f'ing BS. I hate it. Just give me the damned headphone jack, Apple.
  - hnspirit 7y ago
    4m of water-resistance or a headphone jack. The choice is yours! (I'm ok with the dongle)
  - pmarreck 7y ago
    I have Airpods and a set of Sony bluetooth noise-cancelling cans and I do not miss a corded headphone whatsoever, I don’t get what the big deal is here

tuukkah 7y ago

> [W]hen I'm using my phone, I don't want to tinker with it, I want it to just work, and my iPhone does exactly that. Someone has made a bunch of intelligent design decisions about the way things work— much better than with android phones— So you consider an iPhone works so much better and its design is so much better than Android phones that you allow Apple to choose what you can install? I hope you never end in a situation like in Hong Kong where freedom matters more than design.

Analemma_ 7y ago
If you think the fact that your phone runs Android is going to save you if and when the government crackdown comes, I have some bad news for you.
- retpirato 7y ago
  you realize android has custom ROMs, right? IOS doesn't.
gbanfalvi 7y ago
> So you consider an iPhone works so much better and its design is so much better than Android phones that you allow Apple to choose what you can install? Yeah. Lots of people do. Giving up control means a lot, I get it. However I give up control with loads of devices, appliances and services every day. In exchange I expect my iPhone, my gmail account and my Samsung TV to make my life easier. They (hopefully) can’t read my mind, so my choices will always lie on a spectrum between: Taking all control, but having to do all the work myself vs. giving up control (and risk being betrayed) but not having to do the work. > I hope you never end in a situation like in Hong Kong where freedom matters more than design. Absolutely, but I wouldn’t trust most alternatives out there either. I honestly don’t know what I’d do in that case.
hoi 7y ago
Actually, it's a trade off. How much freedom vs how much control. A prime example is government regulators, they are there to 'protect ' consumers vs pure freedom of capital ventures. Pure unadulterated freedom never exists because one persons freedom can trample on another persons, e.g the freedom to be racist

brianpgordon 7y ago

I worry about the legacy we're leaving gen Z, and all of the people just coming online in developed countries, for whom mobile is their native computing environment. We can put our phones away and retreat to our "real computers" to scratch our tinkering itch, but that's not accessible or appealing to everyone. When I was a kid, just clicking all the things opened up new vistas of topics to explore, like clicking "view source" in Netscape Navigator leading to getting a book to learn about HTML. There's no "view source" option in Chrome or Safari for mobile.

ActorNightly 7y ago

There is no tinkering with android phones, not sure if you have ever used one.

jfim 7y ago
Can you elaborate on that? Many Android phones can have their bootloader unlocked, allow installing alternate operating systems, have alternate app stores, and allow sideloading of applications.
- fivefive55 7y ago
  Can being the keyword. None of that is even close to required. You have the option to tinker, you aren't required to.
- mrguyorama 7y ago
  100% of that is optional and entirely unused by most people, excepting maybe a single side-loaded app if they actually care about certain things. This is of course scoped to here in the US, where most of the time Android phones have their OS entirely locked down apart from sideloading apps, ie no running different ROMs, upgrading out of what you're allowed by the network, rooting, running super user apps, etc
retpirato 7y ago
what planet are you living on? you can install custom launchers,dialers,sms, third-party app stores, & pretty much whatever else even without root or flashing a ROM. Not to mention the ability to sideload apps. The sky is the limit with root. There's widgets too, something completely foreign to isheep. There is plenty of tinkering available on android.
- ActorNightly 7y ago
  I meant in the sense of setting it up initially.