4 ms·

Vegetarian food can be delicious or disgusting, just as meat can be. I wouldn't salivate over sitting down to a dinner of boiled stew beef cubes without any se

Vegetarian food can be delicious or disgusting, just as meat can be. I wouldn't salivate over sitting down to a dinner of boiled stew beef cubes without any seasoning at all... Which is pretty much the equivalent of boiled rice and broccoli. (Standard vegetarian fare at a lot of cafeterias in North America). I noticed something yesterday... Capitalistic enterprises really shit on vegetarians for some reason, and I can't quite figure out why. The local pizza place put a flyer in my mailbox... they have plant based pizza now with cauliflower based crusts... vegetarian peperoni and vegan cheese... two servings of vegetables in the crust alone etc etc... That's great, but why does it cost twice as much as all of the other pizzas on offer? Or all of these plant based meat patties that are coming out... twice as expensive as the admittedly more delicious meat based counterparts... and that's buying in bulk, looking for the best deal. I live in Canada, btw.

jccooper 7y ago
Cauliflower costs substantially more than flour, if I were to guess. The plant based patties are highly processed and much lower volume. Why would you expect these things to cost the same?
- jfengel 7y ago
  Possibly because ingredient costs are only a small part of a restaurant's expenses. Staff, rent, utilities, cleaning, etc. make up such a huge part that the food prices can be set primarily in terms of demand. The price of inputs sets a floor on what they can charge, but even if a veggie patty cost twice as much as a beef patty, that would be $.30 rather than $.15. That doesn't justify a cost difference of $4 versus $3 in a fast food place, or $18 versus $15 in a sit-down restaurant. Lots of issues come into play, but I suspect the biggest factor is simply that the restaurant owner believes that the vegetarians self-select to spend more. And they may well be right about it, at least for now. At one time, meats were seen as a luxury (as was dining out), and if vegetarian options become popular, meat eaters insisting on "real meat" may be the ones paying a premium.
  - jccooper 7y ago
    Doubtless there's some pricing power coming into play. An "alternative" is always going to be pricier, else it wouldn't be an alternative, it would just be the thing. But: food costs are something like 25% of a restaurant's costs. Even if the parent is talking exclusively about restaurants, it seems quite reasonable if something like a cauliflower crust is >4x as expensive as something dirt cheap like a flour dough.
gridlockd 7y ago
If you want good vegetarian/vegan cuisine, you shouldn't go to western franchise foods. That's like going to a steak house and ordering a salad. These companies know their customers, they know they generally aren't vegetarians, so they put minimum effort/expertise into an item that few will order anyway. On the other hand, most foreign cuisines have developed good vegetarian dishes out of necessity. Some places even specialize to cater to vegetarians/vegans. That's just as capitalist as the major burger franchise next door. So take your money where your mouth is. > I live in Canada, btw. You do, but you don't have to. Just saying.
deadmetheny 7y ago
>Capitalistic enterprises really shit on vegetarians for some reason, and I can't quite figure out why. What? That's nonsense. You'd be a fool to have nothing suitable for vegetarians on your menu these days, there's quite a lot of them out and about anymore. >The local pizza place put a flyer in my mailbox... they have plant based pizza now with cauliflower based crusts... vegetarian peperoni and vegan cheese... two servings of vegetables in the crust alone etc etc...That's great, but why does it cost twice as much as all of the other pizzas on offer? I own a food service establishment and price is always determined first and foremost by two things: food cost and labour cost. That sort of pizza would be a right pain to make labour-wise, and vegan cheese is very expensive (not to mention dreadfully bad, but I digress). That pizza costing twice as much as anything else sounds a bit on the extreme side but not too terribly out of line, especially if it's a rare order (I suspect it likely is). >I live in Canada, btw. Sorry to hear that, mate ;)
- rwmurrayVT 7y ago
  I'm convinced that abomination called "cheese" never melts.
zelly 7y ago
In the US (likely same for Canada), livestock farmers are given huge subsidies. What a farmer pays for corn for cows is much less than you would pay to buy corn, after accounting for the difference in quality, because they get tax subsidies. So it's actually central planning (socialism) that is making plants more expensive than meat.
sli 7y ago
What's up with these openly anti-Canada quips being added to replies to this comment? That seems wholly unnecessary.

jccooper 7y ago

Cauliflower costs substantially more than flour, if I were to guess. The plant based patties are highly processed and much lower volume. Why would you expect these things to cost the same?

jfengel 7y ago
Possibly because ingredient costs are only a small part of a restaurant's expenses. Staff, rent, utilities, cleaning, etc. make up such a huge part that the food prices can be set primarily in terms of demand. The price of inputs sets a floor on what they can charge, but even if a veggie patty cost twice as much as a beef patty, that would be $.30 rather than $.15. That doesn't justify a cost difference of $4 versus $3 in a fast food place, or $18 versus $15 in a sit-down restaurant. Lots of issues come into play, but I suspect the biggest factor is simply that the restaurant owner believes that the vegetarians self-select to spend more. And they may well be right about it, at least for now. At one time, meats were seen as a luxury (as was dining out), and if vegetarian options become popular, meat eaters insisting on "real meat" may be the ones paying a premium.
- jccooper 7y ago
  Doubtless there's some pricing power coming into play. An "alternative" is always going to be pricier, else it wouldn't be an alternative, it would just be the thing. But: food costs are something like 25% of a restaurant's costs. Even if the parent is talking exclusively about restaurants, it seems quite reasonable if something like a cauliflower crust is >4x as expensive as something dirt cheap like a flour dough.

gridlockd 7y ago

If you want good vegetarian/vegan cuisine, you shouldn't go to western franchise foods. That's like going to a steak house and ordering a salad. These companies know their customers, they know they generally aren't vegetarians, so they put minimum effort/expertise into an item that few will order anyway. On the other hand, most foreign cuisines have developed good vegetarian dishes out of necessity. Some places even specialize to cater to vegetarians/vegans. That's just as capitalist as the major burger franchise next door. So take your money where your mouth is. > I live in Canada, btw. You do, but you don't have to. Just saying.

deadmetheny 7y ago

>Capitalistic enterprises really shit on vegetarians for some reason, and I can't quite figure out why. What? That's nonsense. You'd be a fool to have nothing suitable for vegetarians on your menu these days, there's quite a lot of them out and about anymore. >The local pizza place put a flyer in my mailbox... they have plant based pizza now with cauliflower based crusts... vegetarian peperoni and vegan cheese... two servings of vegetables in the crust alone etc etc...That's great, but why does it cost twice as much as all of the other pizzas on offer? I own a food service establishment and price is always determined first and foremost by two things: food cost and labour cost. That sort of pizza would be a right pain to make labour-wise, and vegan cheese is very expensive (not to mention dreadfully bad, but I digress). That pizza costing twice as much as anything else sounds a bit on the extreme side but not too terribly out of line, especially if it's a rare order (I suspect it likely is). >I live in Canada, btw. Sorry to hear that, mate ;)

rwmurrayVT 7y ago
I'm convinced that abomination called "cheese" never melts.

zelly 7y ago

In the US (likely same for Canada), livestock farmers are given huge subsidies. What a farmer pays for corn for cows is much less than you would pay to buy corn, after accounting for the difference in quality, because they get tax subsidies. So it's actually central planning (socialism) that is making plants more expensive than meat.

sli 7y ago

What's up with these openly anti-Canada quips being added to replies to this comment? That seems wholly unnecessary.