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Do you really think it is appropriate for Visa or Mastercard to decline to process payments for Wikileaks? Or for Youtube to demonetize Conservative voices? The

Do you really think it is appropriate for Visa or Mastercard to decline to process payments for Wikileaks? Or for Youtube to demonetize Conservative voices? These platforms control way too much of today's commerce and speech to be treated as just private corporations exercising their rights. That is a disingenuous disregard for the principle of free speech, which is again, more fundamental than the notion of free speech enshrined in current American law.

deleted 7y ago
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arcticbull 7y ago
Do I want them to do those things? No, definitely not. Do I think there's a basis for my forcing my views on them? Also no. I think it's difficult because you're looking at a change from the status quo. I'd suggest looking at it from a young upstart business perspective. If a new payment processor wants to start up that doesn't cater to the right -- or to the left -- should that be illegal? Probably not. Is it likely to happen and become successful? No, it's a terrible business decision.
- spangry 7y ago
  I'm curious, how far does your belief in freedom of association extend? Should a business be allowed to refuse service to someone because they are black, for example? Does your answer change depending of whether that business has many competitors (e.g. a cake shop) or is a near-total monopoly (e.g. google)?
  - arcticbull 7y ago
    Oof, that's a tough one. > Should a business be allowed to refuse service to someone because they are black, for example? Is it distasteful? Yeah. Is it a good business model? Nope. Should they be forced to do something they don't want to do? It's hard to say. Discriminatory behavior shouldn't happen, and where it creates material harm (employment, for instance) recourse must exist. Otherwise, I don't know, where no harm occurs it's difficult to justify forcing action. > Does your answer change depending of whether that business has many competitors (e.g. a cake shop) or is a near-total monopoly (e.g. google)? I'd suggest when something becomes essential and doesn't have competition then it becomes "de facto infrastructure" and open access rules are justified. I'm trying to come to a conclusion myself here. Thanks for making me think this through!

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

arcticbull 7y ago

Do I want them to do those things? No, definitely not. Do I think there's a basis for my forcing my views on them? Also no. I think it's difficult because you're looking at a change from the status quo. I'd suggest looking at it from a young upstart business perspective. If a new payment processor wants to start up that doesn't cater to the right -- or to the left -- should that be illegal? Probably not. Is it likely to happen and become successful? No, it's a terrible business decision.

spangry 7y ago
I'm curious, how far does your belief in freedom of association extend? Should a business be allowed to refuse service to someone because they are black, for example? Does your answer change depending of whether that business has many competitors (e.g. a cake shop) or is a near-total monopoly (e.g. google)?
- arcticbull 7y ago
  Oof, that's a tough one. > Should a business be allowed to refuse service to someone because they are black, for example? Is it distasteful? Yeah. Is it a good business model? Nope. Should they be forced to do something they don't want to do? It's hard to say. Discriminatory behavior shouldn't happen, and where it creates material harm (employment, for instance) recourse must exist. Otherwise, I don't know, where no harm occurs it's difficult to justify forcing action. > Does your answer change depending of whether that business has many competitors (e.g. a cake shop) or is a near-total monopoly (e.g. google)? I'd suggest when something becomes essential and doesn't have competition then it becomes "de facto infrastructure" and open access rules are justified. I'm trying to come to a conclusion myself here. Thanks for making me think this through!