6 ms·

This is one reason why I don't like living near freeways, especially near on-ramps, off-ramps, and interchanges. Car pollution isn't just tailpipe emissions - I

This is one reason why I don't like living near freeways, especially near on-ramps, off-ramps, and interchanges. Car pollution isn't just tailpipe emissions - I believe a lot of airborne particulates come from tires and brakes (especially during acceleration, deceleration, and turning). https://www.cdc.gov/air/particulate_matter.html https://www.cdc.gov/air/particulate_matter.html

anon1m0us 7y ago
The airborne particulates from brakes is asbestos! edit: Very odd that both mine and the contradictory reply to it are both down voted. What I said is a fact, so I'm not sure why anyone would disagree with it.
- dsfyu404ed 7y ago
  This hasn't been the case since the early 80s. Edit: Yes, you can probably find some no-name pads with asbestos if you look hard. Nobody is selling them knowingly in the US or EU. There are definitively some pads/shoes from the far east that contain asbestos. They don't get purchased by the auto parts stores and big parts suppliers that supply the shops that change most of the countries brakes. They get sold to importers who don't care what they're made of who are selling them on Amazon/Ebay/etc to DIYers at bottom dollar prices. That is such a tiny slice of a tiny slice of all pads it's basically nonexistant.
  - everdrive 7y ago
    Without sarcasm, what are "raybestos" brakes made out of then? [edit] Thanks all for the clarification.
    - dsfyu404ed 7y ago
      Not asbestos and haven't been for decades. They actually have something like "contain no asbestos" on the box (or maybe it's on a piece of paper in the box, it's been awhile).
    - bcrosby95 7y ago
      https://www.asbestos.com/companies/raybestos-manhattan-raymark-industries/ https://www.asbestos.com/companies/raybestos-manhattan-rayma... Apparently the company hasn't produced a product with asbestos in it since the 80s.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
  - badrequest 7y ago
    According to the Wikipedia article[1] for the company mentioned in one of the other replies to this comment: > The Raymark facility operated at (the Stratford) location from 1919 until 1989, manufacturing asbestos brake linings and other automotive asbestos products. so it hasn't been true for 30 years. :) [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raybestos#Superfund_site_cleanup https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raybestos#Superfund_site_clean...
  - likpok 7y ago
    Ford was shipping cars with asbestos brakes in 1993. Asbestos brakes are still readily available on the aftermarket. Brake pads since 2015 sold in California and Washington must have less than 0.1% asbestos by weight (it's unclear to me if that's asbestos alone, or asbestos and other heavy metals like cadmium or mercury). Since the ban was put into place in 2015, you can reasonably infer a) that there were brake pads above that limit in 2014 and b) there are brake pads slightly under that limit today.
    - dajohnson89 7y ago
      the subway brakes in washington dc are abestos brakes. you can smell them quite strongly.
      - nathancahill 7y ago
        Huh, TIL. Never knew what that smell was.
        undersuit 7y ago
        Something's fishy: http://unsuckdcmetro.blogspot.com/2012/01/whats-that-foul-smell.html http://unsuckdcmetro.blogspot.com/2012/01/whats-that-foul-sm...
      - kleton 7y ago
        Can you really smell asbestos? I can't imagine silicate rock having a very high vapour pressure.
      - undersuit 7y ago
        In 1980? https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/local/1980/11/11/latest-metro-problem-subway-trains-with-brakes-that-shriek/b6dca2e9-2d6d-4e02-80cd-cffaa0d51665/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/local/1980/11/11/late...
      - rootusrootus 7y ago
        That is not correct. WMATA hasn't used asbestos brake pads in many years. Whatever you think you smell, that's not it
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
hinkley 7y ago
Came up in conversation when I took my car in that up until recently they were using little bits of copper in brake pads for... noise control? heat? I can't recall which. But that's been outlawed now, presumably due to potential for metal toxicity (any mineral you need in your diet is also lethal at higher doses). We're leaving powdered copper at every stop light.
- reaperducer 7y ago
  Weren't brakes made of asbestos at one time?
  - kube-system 7y ago
    Canada banned asbestos brakes this year. Brakes are still exempted under US asbestos bans. Manufacturers and repair shops avoid them for obvious reasons, but they're not illegal. https://www.baltimoresun.com/news/bs-xpm-2006-05-04-0605040031-story.html https://www.baltimoresun.com/news/bs-xpm-2006-05-04-06050400... https://canada.autonews.com/article/20180107/CANADA/180109830/asbestos-ban-affecting-brake-pads-now-planned-for-2019 https://canada.autonews.com/article/20180107/CANADA/18010983...
  - hinkley 7y ago
    There's another thread that claims that was 50 years ago. I believe a lot of the stopping power comes from ceramic cinders in the pads. Those showed up in high end bicycle brake pads about 25 years ago, and I think they were old news in high performance cars before that. I have a fuzzy recollection that they trickled down into mid-tier vehicles not long after that. 2000-ish?
  - acomjean 7y ago
    they were. But they used asbestos in a lot of things back in the day. I worked in a building with asbestos in the floor tiles. When they did constructions that involved removing the tiles, it became a big deal. Asbestos isn't that harmful, until it goes airborne. My understanding from research (I worked expanding a landfill that took asbestos at one point). is that the particles are too small to be caught by our bodies defenses and when it ends up in your lungs its cancerous. Asbestos in brakes seems like a bad idea. see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesothelioma https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesothelioma
cwkoss 7y ago
Cody's Lab did an episode where he collected and refined freeway dust: it's actually decent grade platinum 'ore' from catalytic converter deposition https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5GPWJPLcHg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5GPWJPLcHg
- newnewpdro 7y ago
  Sure, in small quantities, it's not the majority of the volume they collected though.
  - cwkoss 7y ago
    Mining operations rarely find pure metals in the ground. Ore is a dilute mixture of rock with trace metals which must be extracted through processing.
    - newnewpdro 7y ago
      To categorize what's found on the shoulders of highways entirely as an ore of some trace metal is to completely dismiss the rest of its content as irrelevant, despite being the bulk of its volume, in a discussion ostensibly about pollution.
      - deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
claudeganon 7y ago
I once had to wait at a bus stop right next to the 405 in Los Angeles for a good 30 minutes. It felt like being suffocated.
fokinsean 7y ago
Up until 97(?) brakes used to be lined with asbestos. It wouldn't surprise me if there is a detectable amount close to highways as well.
jartelt 7y ago
California air quality regulators have stated that we shouldn't have any housing within 500 feet of freeways. Living near freeways increases your risk of a host of negative health effects (asthma, heart issues, etc). https://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-freeway-pollution-what-you-can-do-20171230-htmlstory.html https://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-freeway-pollu...
- RandomInteger4 7y ago
  Maybe California should worry about having adequate affordable housing before worrying about where said housing is located.
  - roflchoppa2 7y ago
    yeah fuck em, lets just put them next to the oil distilleries in Richmond. freeway and air pollutants.
    - RandomInteger4 7y ago
      A cheaper home next to a freeway is probably healthier than living on the street.
sjg007 7y ago
You don't want to live within 5 miles of a freeway or major road really..

anon1m0us 7y ago

The airborne particulates from brakes is asbestos! edit: Very odd that both mine and the contradictory reply to it are both down voted. What I said is a fact, so I'm not sure why anyone would disagree with it.

dsfyu404ed 7y ago
This hasn't been the case since the early 80s. Edit: Yes, you can probably find some no-name pads with asbestos if you look hard. Nobody is selling them knowingly in the US or EU. There are definitively some pads/shoes from the far east that contain asbestos. They don't get purchased by the auto parts stores and big parts suppliers that supply the shops that change most of the countries brakes. They get sold to importers who don't care what they're made of who are selling them on Amazon/Ebay/etc to DIYers at bottom dollar prices. That is such a tiny slice of a tiny slice of all pads it's basically nonexistant.
- everdrive 7y ago
  Without sarcasm, what are "raybestos" brakes made out of then? [edit] Thanks all for the clarification.
  - dsfyu404ed 7y ago
    Not asbestos and haven't been for decades. They actually have something like "contain no asbestos" on the box (or maybe it's on a piece of paper in the box, it's been awhile).
  - bcrosby95 7y ago
    https://www.asbestos.com/companies/raybestos-manhattan-raymark-industries/ https://www.asbestos.com/companies/raybestos-manhattan-rayma... Apparently the company hasn't produced a product with asbestos in it since the 80s.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- badrequest 7y ago
  According to the Wikipedia article[1] for the company mentioned in one of the other replies to this comment: > The Raymark facility operated at (the Stratford) location from 1919 until 1989, manufacturing asbestos brake linings and other automotive asbestos products. so it hasn't been true for 30 years. :) [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raybestos#Superfund_site_cleanup https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raybestos#Superfund_site_clean...
- likpok 7y ago
  Ford was shipping cars with asbestos brakes in 1993. Asbestos brakes are still readily available on the aftermarket. Brake pads since 2015 sold in California and Washington must have less than 0.1% asbestos by weight (it's unclear to me if that's asbestos alone, or asbestos and other heavy metals like cadmium or mercury). Since the ban was put into place in 2015, you can reasonably infer a) that there were brake pads above that limit in 2014 and b) there are brake pads slightly under that limit today.
  - dajohnson89 7y ago
    the subway brakes in washington dc are abestos brakes. you can smell them quite strongly.
    - nathancahill 7y ago
      Huh, TIL. Never knew what that smell was.
      - undersuit 7y ago
        Something's fishy: http://unsuckdcmetro.blogspot.com/2012/01/whats-that-foul-smell.html http://unsuckdcmetro.blogspot.com/2012/01/whats-that-foul-sm...
    - kleton 7y ago
      Can you really smell asbestos? I can't imagine silicate rock having a very high vapour pressure.
    - undersuit 7y ago
      In 1980? https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/local/1980/11/11/latest-metro-problem-subway-trains-with-brakes-that-shriek/b6dca2e9-2d6d-4e02-80cd-cffaa0d51665/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/local/1980/11/11/late...
    - rootusrootus 7y ago
      That is not correct. WMATA hasn't used asbestos brake pads in many years. Whatever you think you smell, that's not it
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

hinkley 7y ago

Came up in conversation when I took my car in that up until recently they were using little bits of copper in brake pads for... noise control? heat? I can't recall which. But that's been outlawed now, presumably due to potential for metal toxicity (any mineral you need in your diet is also lethal at higher doses). We're leaving powdered copper at every stop light.

reaperducer 7y ago
Weren't brakes made of asbestos at one time?
- kube-system 7y ago
  Canada banned asbestos brakes this year. Brakes are still exempted under US asbestos bans. Manufacturers and repair shops avoid them for obvious reasons, but they're not illegal. https://www.baltimoresun.com/news/bs-xpm-2006-05-04-0605040031-story.html https://www.baltimoresun.com/news/bs-xpm-2006-05-04-06050400... https://canada.autonews.com/article/20180107/CANADA/180109830/asbestos-ban-affecting-brake-pads-now-planned-for-2019 https://canada.autonews.com/article/20180107/CANADA/18010983...
- hinkley 7y ago
  There's another thread that claims that was 50 years ago. I believe a lot of the stopping power comes from ceramic cinders in the pads. Those showed up in high end bicycle brake pads about 25 years ago, and I think they were old news in high performance cars before that. I have a fuzzy recollection that they trickled down into mid-tier vehicles not long after that. 2000-ish?
- acomjean 7y ago
  they were. But they used asbestos in a lot of things back in the day. I worked in a building with asbestos in the floor tiles. When they did constructions that involved removing the tiles, it became a big deal. Asbestos isn't that harmful, until it goes airborne. My understanding from research (I worked expanding a landfill that took asbestos at one point). is that the particles are too small to be caught by our bodies defenses and when it ends up in your lungs its cancerous. Asbestos in brakes seems like a bad idea. see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesothelioma https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesothelioma

cwkoss 7y ago

Cody's Lab did an episode where he collected and refined freeway dust: it's actually decent grade platinum 'ore' from catalytic converter deposition https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5GPWJPLcHg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5GPWJPLcHg

newnewpdro 7y ago
Sure, in small quantities, it's not the majority of the volume they collected though.
- cwkoss 7y ago
  Mining operations rarely find pure metals in the ground. Ore is a dilute mixture of rock with trace metals which must be extracted through processing.
  - newnewpdro 7y ago
    To categorize what's found on the shoulders of highways entirely as an ore of some trace metal is to completely dismiss the rest of its content as irrelevant, despite being the bulk of its volume, in a discussion ostensibly about pollution.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]

claudeganon 7y ago

I once had to wait at a bus stop right next to the 405 in Los Angeles for a good 30 minutes. It felt like being suffocated.

fokinsean 7y ago

Up until 97(?) brakes used to be lined with asbestos. It wouldn't surprise me if there is a detectable amount close to highways as well.

jartelt 7y ago

California air quality regulators have stated that we shouldn't have any housing within 500 feet of freeways. Living near freeways increases your risk of a host of negative health effects (asthma, heart issues, etc). https://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-freeway-pollution-what-you-can-do-20171230-htmlstory.html https://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-freeway-pollu...

RandomInteger4 7y ago
Maybe California should worry about having adequate affordable housing before worrying about where said housing is located.
- roflchoppa2 7y ago
  yeah fuck em, lets just put them next to the oil distilleries in Richmond. freeway and air pollutants.
  - RandomInteger4 7y ago
    A cheaper home next to a freeway is probably healthier than living on the street.

sjg007 7y ago

You don't want to live within 5 miles of a freeway or major road really..