5 ms·

Given the fact that the economy is at full employment and that there are more job openings than people looking for a job, I'm not too worried at the moment.

autoexec 7y ago
> Given the fact that the economy is at full employment The economy might be at full employment, but people are often underemployed, getting few hours, and shit wages. Most people are employed but many don't make enough to support even just themselves on their earnings let alone a family. Real wages have barely increased since the 1970s while costs have risen. We've had the first generations of Americans who are worse off than their parents. I wouldn't say our current situation was at all encouraging.
- malandrew 7y ago
  > underemployed I don't get why we use this term. You're either employed or you're not. Just because you got an education in something that is no longer valued by society doesn't mean you're entitled to a job doing whatever you're educated to do. Society rewards those that provide some good or service that is wanted/needed. Furthermore, employment by others is not the only option. You can also work for yourself (except when the state forbids it through licensing and permits)
  - ajwin 7y ago
    Correct me if I am wrong but doesn't under employed often also refer to when you have part time / casual work but want full time employment? You might not be able to survive of what your earning but your not part of the Unemployment statistics?
  - taneq 7y ago
    We have a term, "employed", for people who work and earn a living wage. We have another term, "unemployed", for people who have no work. We need a third term, "underemployed", to describe people in between those two situations, who have some work (so they're not "unemployed") but nonetheless do not earn a living wage (so counting them as "employed" is disingenuous).
- malandrew 7y ago
  > Real wages have barely increased since the 1970s while costs have risen. "Where has all the income gone" Minneapolis FED research https://www.minneapolisfed.org/publications/the-region/where-has-all-the-income-gone https://www.minneapolisfed.org/publications/the-region/where...
wavefunction 7y ago
Seems like a poor way to rationalize avoiding planning ahead. The number of open positions says nothing about the nature of the work. I can open a position for a doctor to work for me for $100 a month and while it's an "open position" it will not be and could never be filled and yet it's still a job opening. In addition some people are working multiple jobs to barely survive so again there is no defined relationship of number of jobs to number of workers or whether that's a good or a bad thing. I would agree with you if wages had risen enough that workers could work one job and have their needs met but that won't happen any time soon, especially with robots on the horizon. The only thing that makes sense is to plan ahead.
freeflight 7y ago
Some people argue there's this thing called "bullshit jobs" [0] making up a substantial part of the modern job economies. [0] https://www.strike.coop/bullshit-jobs/ https://www.strike.coop/bullshit-jobs/
rhacker 7y ago
I don't know, I've never seen this many homeless people in my life.
- ProZsolt 7y ago
  I think that caused by social separation. Today people have hundreds or even thousands of "facebook friends" but not one where they can sleep on the couch when they are down. Also consumerism. Lots of people have the latest and greatest iPhone and OLED TV but don't have 6 months worth of savings(I think that's the minimum you should have) in the bank. It's a lot harder to find your next job when you stressing because you are going to be evicted.
x220 7y ago
Avoiding the question entirely? I'd expect nothing less from someone who will be the last to suffer the consequences of automation.
bavell 7y ago
> full employment Where are you getting this? From the govt statistics that don't include people who have dropped out of the workforce entirely? The same stats that don't differentiate between a salaried career and scraping by in the transient gig economy? I'm extremely skeptical. Can we afford to just dismiss all these legitimate concerns because, "the govt told me everything is okay"?

autoexec 7y ago

> Given the fact that the economy is at full employment The economy might be at full employment, but people are often underemployed, getting few hours, and shit wages. Most people are employed but many don't make enough to support even just themselves on their earnings let alone a family. Real wages have barely increased since the 1970s while costs have risen. We've had the first generations of Americans who are worse off than their parents. I wouldn't say our current situation was at all encouraging.

malandrew 7y ago
> underemployed I don't get why we use this term. You're either employed or you're not. Just because you got an education in something that is no longer valued by society doesn't mean you're entitled to a job doing whatever you're educated to do. Society rewards those that provide some good or service that is wanted/needed. Furthermore, employment by others is not the only option. You can also work for yourself (except when the state forbids it through licensing and permits)
- ajwin 7y ago
  Correct me if I am wrong but doesn't under employed often also refer to when you have part time / casual work but want full time employment? You might not be able to survive of what your earning but your not part of the Unemployment statistics?
- taneq 7y ago
  We have a term, "employed", for people who work and earn a living wage. We have another term, "unemployed", for people who have no work. We need a third term, "underemployed", to describe people in between those two situations, who have some work (so they're not "unemployed") but nonetheless do not earn a living wage (so counting them as "employed" is disingenuous).
malandrew 7y ago
> Real wages have barely increased since the 1970s while costs have risen. "Where has all the income gone" Minneapolis FED research https://www.minneapolisfed.org/publications/the-region/where-has-all-the-income-gone https://www.minneapolisfed.org/publications/the-region/where...

wavefunction 7y ago

Seems like a poor way to rationalize avoiding planning ahead. The number of open positions says nothing about the nature of the work. I can open a position for a doctor to work for me for $100 a month and while it's an "open position" it will not be and could never be filled and yet it's still a job opening. In addition some people are working multiple jobs to barely survive so again there is no defined relationship of number of jobs to number of workers or whether that's a good or a bad thing. I would agree with you if wages had risen enough that workers could work one job and have their needs met but that won't happen any time soon, especially with robots on the horizon. The only thing that makes sense is to plan ahead.

freeflight 7y ago

Some people argue there's this thing called "bullshit jobs" [0] making up a substantial part of the modern job economies. [0] https://www.strike.coop/bullshit-jobs/ https://www.strike.coop/bullshit-jobs/

rhacker 7y ago

I don't know, I've never seen this many homeless people in my life.

ProZsolt 7y ago
I think that caused by social separation. Today people have hundreds or even thousands of "facebook friends" but not one where they can sleep on the couch when they are down. Also consumerism. Lots of people have the latest and greatest iPhone and OLED TV but don't have 6 months worth of savings(I think that's the minimum you should have) in the bank. It's a lot harder to find your next job when you stressing because you are going to be evicted.

x220 7y ago

Avoiding the question entirely? I'd expect nothing less from someone who will be the last to suffer the consequences of automation.

bavell 7y ago

> full employment Where are you getting this? From the govt statistics that don't include people who have dropped out of the workforce entirely? The same stats that don't differentiate between a salaried career and scraping by in the transient gig economy? I'm extremely skeptical. Can we afford to just dismiss all these legitimate concerns because, "the govt told me everything is okay"?