5 ms·

as a serial victim to sets of questions exactly like this earlier in my life, i've come to realize that 'Culture-fit' is really just a coded honesty test -- and

by serf 7y ago

as a serial victim to sets of questions exactly like this earlier in my life, i've come to realize that 'Culture-fit' is really just a coded honesty test -- and the most deceptive thing about it is that straight honesty is one of the quickest ways to do poorly at it. in other words, answering '1. Why do you want to work for our company?' with "Because I want a salary and I need to avoid destitution.' is a wholly appropriate answer, but it's wrong. They actually just want you to evangelize the company for a few minutes and lay on how envious you are of those that have 'the opportunity' to 'be a part of the revolution at X-Co'.

tylerl 7y ago
The relevant bit in "Why do you want to work for our company" is the unstated "...as oppose to another." Ideally the answer is some property of the company that aligns well with the candidates ideals. But it presupposes that the candidate knows of some attribute that fits this frame. A better question might be to make the company attribute hypothetical. Something like: "if you could propose a rule for all employees at the company where you want to work, what would it be." You'd definitely need follow-up questions and promoting, but it could be way more insightful.
- username90 7y ago
  The question "Why do you want to work for our company" can always be answered with "I want to work with great coworkers and I've heard you have really great people here" no matter what company it is.
  - whenchamenia 7y ago
    I could nave a few in SV where this would undoubtably raise suspicion. Many of the hottest companies are well known for being successful dispite (because of?) their challanging working environments. At first you would wonder why anyone would bother when the pay is often similar, but talented people seek a challenge. Many of the most tempermental composers always had a line of the best musicians waiting to suffer near-abuse just to have a crack at attempting something amazingly difficult that they respect.
gatherhunterer 7y ago
Who would want to hire a candidate who cannot get through an interview without delving into their personal issues and giving sardonic, jaded answers? Hacker news is big on edgy developers who insist that they can work hard, solve problems and get along with everyone. But if you ask them to explain how they do that they cry oppression.
- yoz-y 7y ago
  Sometimes it does appear that the dream interview for many would be: Read my CV and hire me because I did a lot of stuff at company X already.
  - ChuckNorris89 7y ago
    That's pretty much how you get hired in Europe as nobody does leetcode and rarely you get whiteboard or take home problems. If you have enough experience at some prestigious company, the job is already yours, the on site interview is pretty much a formality to discuss salary expectations and screen for red flags.
    - yoz-y 7y ago
      I am from Europe and I had a bit of everything. But generally I agree, even when I was conducting the interviews, it was mostly to verify that what was written on the CV was reflected in reality.
  - malvosenior 7y ago
    That’s a great way to hire someone. Have they produced quality product? Hire. Culture games like this speak more about the toxicity of the employer than anything about the employee. Do you really think subjective questions like this as interpreted by hr or a random manager say anything? It’s purely a power play against the prospective employee. Good managers can manage all kinds of people. Culture fit is just looking for koolaide drinkers.
    - izacus 7y ago
codyb 7y ago
To be fair, most Software Engineers are able to secure multiple offers and even more interviews. Or at least that’s my impression which may be the result of survivorship bias. And it only gets easier after your first gig. In that instance, where an engineer can easily leave your company, it makes sense to want to ensure they really want the position since interviewing and onboarding are very expensive for a company as well as having someone leave with a bunch of institutional knowledge built up over the years. It’s also probably the easiest question in the world to totally bullshit with just a vague grasp of what the company does. “One of the things that really excited me about <company X> is the problems you must face dealing with <such large amounts of data, securing your system, supporting N users on the app at once, syncing data across data zones>” etc etc. or “I think it’d be really neat to work at a company in the <healthcare, finance, whatever> industry because I’ve always wanted to <improve lives, learn about high frequency trading>” And even if it’s an easy enough thing to BS it should also be genuinely easy to find an exciting reason to want to work somewhere in our field.
- astura 7y ago
  It depends heavily on your area and the current economy. For example, almost nobody was hiring for software in my area during the Great Recession and I was laid off from the job I did have. Ended up having to relocate so I didn't starve. Nowadays there's plenty of people hiring but companies around here tend to underpay.
  - ChuckNorris89 7y ago
    >Nowadays there's plenty of people hiring but companies around here tend to underpay. Mind sharing which area are you referring to? Sounds like Europe :)
    - astura 7y ago
      No, I live in the NE USA, but outside of any big cities but definitely not in a rural area. My country has a population of ~300,000. Nowadays I'd probably be paid more if I still lived in my hometown that I had to leave (ironically). Job hopping definitely isn't a big thing around here like in tech hubs - new hires don't get huge salaries starting out no matter how much experience you have.
turtlecloud 7y ago
I believe UBI to drastically change the style of responses to these questions.
- sabujp 7y ago
  UBI's not going get anyone very far. $1k a month or whatever it is is barely enough to afford a room in a large city
  - krapp 7y ago
    UBI isn't meant to get anyone very far, it's meant to keep people from starving to death. If you want or need more, you can still work. Also, plenty of people don't live in large cities.
linsomniac 7y ago
With all due respect, your entire reply here reads to me as someone that I would not want to work with. My group at work is largely full of people who believe in what we do, enjoy the work we do, and feel an obligation to our users. For many groups, the only thing more important than getting the right people in, is keeping the wrong people out. Your talented employees can probably quite easily find a lateral move. Hiring the wrong person can lose you several of your most talented team members.

by serf 7y ago

tylerl 7y ago

The relevant bit in "Why do you want to work for our company" is the unstated "...as oppose to another." Ideally the answer is some property of the company that aligns well with the candidates ideals. But it presupposes that the candidate knows of some attribute that fits this frame. A better question might be to make the company attribute hypothetical. Something like: "if you could propose a rule for all employees at the company where you want to work, what would it be." You'd definitely need follow-up questions and promoting, but it could be way more insightful.

username90 7y ago
The question "Why do you want to work for our company" can always be answered with "I want to work with great coworkers and I've heard you have really great people here" no matter what company it is.
- whenchamenia 7y ago
  I could nave a few in SV where this would undoubtably raise suspicion. Many of the hottest companies are well known for being successful dispite (because of?) their challanging working environments. At first you would wonder why anyone would bother when the pay is often similar, but talented people seek a challenge. Many of the most tempermental composers always had a line of the best musicians waiting to suffer near-abuse just to have a crack at attempting something amazingly difficult that they respect.

gatherhunterer 7y ago

Who would want to hire a candidate who cannot get through an interview without delving into their personal issues and giving sardonic, jaded answers? Hacker news is big on edgy developers who insist that they can work hard, solve problems and get along with everyone. But if you ask them to explain how they do that they cry oppression.

yoz-y 7y ago
Sometimes it does appear that the dream interview for many would be: Read my CV and hire me because I did a lot of stuff at company X already.
- ChuckNorris89 7y ago
  That's pretty much how you get hired in Europe as nobody does leetcode and rarely you get whiteboard or take home problems. If you have enough experience at some prestigious company, the job is already yours, the on site interview is pretty much a formality to discuss salary expectations and screen for red flags.
  - yoz-y 7y ago
    I am from Europe and I had a bit of everything. But generally I agree, even when I was conducting the interviews, it was mostly to verify that what was written on the CV was reflected in reality.
- malvosenior 7y ago
  That’s a great way to hire someone. Have they produced quality product? Hire. Culture games like this speak more about the toxicity of the employer than anything about the employee. Do you really think subjective questions like this as interpreted by hr or a random manager say anything? It’s purely a power play against the prospective employee. Good managers can manage all kinds of people. Culture fit is just looking for koolaide drinkers.
  - izacus 7y ago

codyb 7y ago

To be fair, most Software Engineers are able to secure multiple offers and even more interviews. Or at least that’s my impression which may be the result of survivorship bias. And it only gets easier after your first gig. In that instance, where an engineer can easily leave your company, it makes sense to want to ensure they really want the position since interviewing and onboarding are very expensive for a company as well as having someone leave with a bunch of institutional knowledge built up over the years. It’s also probably the easiest question in the world to totally bullshit with just a vague grasp of what the company does. “One of the things that really excited me about <company X> is the problems you must face dealing with <such large amounts of data, securing your system, supporting N users on the app at once, syncing data across data zones>” etc etc. or “I think it’d be really neat to work at a company in the <healthcare, finance, whatever> industry because I’ve always wanted to <improve lives, learn about high frequency trading>” And even if it’s an easy enough thing to BS it should also be genuinely easy to find an exciting reason to want to work somewhere in our field.

astura 7y ago
It depends heavily on your area and the current economy. For example, almost nobody was hiring for software in my area during the Great Recession and I was laid off from the job I did have. Ended up having to relocate so I didn't starve. Nowadays there's plenty of people hiring but companies around here tend to underpay.
- ChuckNorris89 7y ago
  >Nowadays there's plenty of people hiring but companies around here tend to underpay. Mind sharing which area are you referring to? Sounds like Europe :)
  - astura 7y ago
    No, I live in the NE USA, but outside of any big cities but definitely not in a rural area. My country has a population of ~300,000. Nowadays I'd probably be paid more if I still lived in my hometown that I had to leave (ironically). Job hopping definitely isn't a big thing around here like in tech hubs - new hires don't get huge salaries starting out no matter how much experience you have.

turtlecloud 7y ago

I believe UBI to drastically change the style of responses to these questions.

sabujp 7y ago
UBI's not going get anyone very far. $1k a month or whatever it is is barely enough to afford a room in a large city
- krapp 7y ago
  UBI isn't meant to get anyone very far, it's meant to keep people from starving to death. If you want or need more, you can still work. Also, plenty of people don't live in large cities.

linsomniac 7y ago

With all due respect, your entire reply here reads to me as someone that I would not want to work with. My group at work is largely full of people who believe in what we do, enjoy the work we do, and feel an obligation to our users. For many groups, the only thing more important than getting the right people in, is keeping the wrong people out. Your talented employees can probably quite easily find a lateral move. Hiring the wrong person can lose you several of your most talented team members.