7 ms·

The article talks at length about guys who are struggling or generally worse off than women but it makes no mention of the guys who have given up. I wonder how

The article talks at length about guys who are struggling or generally worse off than women but it makes no mention of the guys who have given up. I wonder how much that plays a role? The Japanese media have tales for years about Hikikomori [1] but the phenomenon certainly isn’t unique to Japan. It’s one thing to call someone lazy, it’s quite another to try to understand why they live the way they do. Personally, I don’t believe in laziness as a real concept, at least not over the long term. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hikikomori https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hikikomori

rblion 7y ago
I think this is a bigger problem than just economics, it's a cultural one too. You have a entire generation of boys/teens/men who either grew up with or are growing up with an endless amount of entertainment (games, movies, shows, music, porn, drugs), the consequences of outsourcing and automation, and the rise of feminism/PC-culture. All at one time, of course many are giving up or just opting out. I've dated women I thought I wanted. One was a very attractive girl who was into astronomy and whose movie was Jurassic Park. She also had Borderline Personality Disorder. I recently dated an older woman who is a musician and a hardcore vegan, I parted ways with her because I realized I would never be able to live up their list for a 'perfect partner'. I'm 29, maybe I'll settle down in my 30's. Maybe not. I honestly don't know. I don't think being married is for everyone. I have some friends and family who are married, they don't always seem happier. If anything, some of them seem trapped. For now, creativity, learning, and travel are more fulfilling to me than dating, meaningless sex, chasing women.
- nailer 7y ago
  Things change after both sexes around 27. Your demand as an older male will cross hers as as younger woman. You're 29. Wait.
  - rblion 7y ago
    I'm not worried about meeting women at all, I meet them all the time without putting in much effort. I'm just not sold on the idea of a wife and kids anymore, I used to think I 'had to' have that to be complete. I'm open to whatever life presents now as I go into my 30's.
    - nailer 7y ago
      That's fine. You're not under any biological pressure. As long as you're physically fit you have time to change your mind if you wish to do so.
fre3k 7y ago
I make good money (being a reasonably able software dev), and though physically attracted to women, am not interested in them, and haven't been for over a decade now. I was somewhat successful in my youth, but certainly no cassanova. I find chasing and/or engaging in romantic relationships with women costs me far more than I estimate their worth at (the relationship, not the women themselves). And I'm not just talking money. I'm talking time, freedom, responsibility, cognitive cycles, etc. I think my time is best spent elsewhere on hobbies or video games or mindless entertainment or work.
- lazyjones 7y ago
  I presume you've heard of the https://www.mgtow.com https://www.mgtow.com community/movement?
  - fre3k 7y ago
    Sure, but I don't identify with it. I haven't really been hurt past, you know, hey I like this girl and she doesn't like me boo hoo. Just don't find the pursuit or the time dedications or the impact on my life worth it.
    - mikelyons 7y ago
      The truth is that it's not. Good on ya
    - newnewpdro 7y ago
      It's not, unless you want to start a family. Then the whole vetting process disguised as "dating" is kind of important with significant life-changing returns. Personally I decided I didn't want kids decades ago, it drastically changed the distribution of priorities. I, like you, simply can't be bothered with dating now. It's just not worth the time and effort, risk of STDs, risk of pregnancy, risk of crazy, drama, etc. Having said that however, there is something to be said for having a reliable partner in old age when hospital visits and navigating the healthcare system becomes a regular activity. It's problematic to be alone in a hospital, for a variety of reasons.

rblion 7y ago

I think this is a bigger problem than just economics, it's a cultural one too. You have a entire generation of boys/teens/men who either grew up with or are growing up with an endless amount of entertainment (games, movies, shows, music, porn, drugs), the consequences of outsourcing and automation, and the rise of feminism/PC-culture. All at one time, of course many are giving up or just opting out. I've dated women I thought I wanted. One was a very attractive girl who was into astronomy and whose movie was Jurassic Park. She also had Borderline Personality Disorder. I recently dated an older woman who is a musician and a hardcore vegan, I parted ways with her because I realized I would never be able to live up their list for a 'perfect partner'. I'm 29, maybe I'll settle down in my 30's. Maybe not. I honestly don't know. I don't think being married is for everyone. I have some friends and family who are married, they don't always seem happier. If anything, some of them seem trapped. For now, creativity, learning, and travel are more fulfilling to me than dating, meaningless sex, chasing women.

nailer 7y ago
Things change after both sexes around 27. Your demand as an older male will cross hers as as younger woman. You're 29. Wait.
- rblion 7y ago
  I'm not worried about meeting women at all, I meet them all the time without putting in much effort. I'm just not sold on the idea of a wife and kids anymore, I used to think I 'had to' have that to be complete. I'm open to whatever life presents now as I go into my 30's.
  - nailer 7y ago
    That's fine. You're not under any biological pressure. As long as you're physically fit you have time to change your mind if you wish to do so.

fre3k 7y ago

I make good money (being a reasonably able software dev), and though physically attracted to women, am not interested in them, and haven't been for over a decade now. I was somewhat successful in my youth, but certainly no cassanova. I find chasing and/or engaging in romantic relationships with women costs me far more than I estimate their worth at (the relationship, not the women themselves). And I'm not just talking money. I'm talking time, freedom, responsibility, cognitive cycles, etc. I think my time is best spent elsewhere on hobbies or video games or mindless entertainment or work.

lazyjones 7y ago
I presume you've heard of the https://www.mgtow.com https://www.mgtow.com community/movement?
- fre3k 7y ago
  Sure, but I don't identify with it. I haven't really been hurt past, you know, hey I like this girl and she doesn't like me boo hoo. Just don't find the pursuit or the time dedications or the impact on my life worth it.
  - mikelyons 7y ago
    The truth is that it's not. Good on ya
  - newnewpdro 7y ago
    It's not, unless you want to start a family. Then the whole vetting process disguised as "dating" is kind of important with significant life-changing returns. Personally I decided I didn't want kids decades ago, it drastically changed the distribution of priorities. I, like you, simply can't be bothered with dating now. It's just not worth the time and effort, risk of STDs, risk of pregnancy, risk of crazy, drama, etc. Having said that however, there is something to be said for having a reliable partner in old age when hospital visits and navigating the healthcare system becomes a regular activity. It's problematic to be alone in a hospital, for a variety of reasons.