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This is why I refuse to do stand ups
by t34543 7y ago
This is why I refuse to do stand ups
- alexis_fr 7y agoStandups to me are just a way to ensure everyone is awake. And able to answer a simple question and make a sentence. I don’t exactly care about the contents, except from time to time when it makes us notice that a colleague is on a wrong track.
- fhbdukfrh 7y agoThey have real value in building team: We are all standing around in a circle; our alignment means something. They're also one of my easiest ways to include remote workers- they always go first. (the phone is part of the circle)
- machinelearning 7y agoDepends on the kind of person. Surely a lot of programmers do not care about that kind of contrived team building. Solving a high priority bug or patching a server during downtime typically builds closer bonds.
- nitely 7y agoWell said. Trust falls bring great value as well.
- kelnos 7y agoThat's contrived and juvenile. Standing in a circle with my team engaging in process for the sake of process doesn't make me feel like a part of a team. Getting stuff done and working directly with teammates on a daily basis, coordinating in person, on Slack, however we choose to do it, organically, is what makes me feel closer to my team.
- ken 7y agoAren't those contradictory? Someone talking on the phone clearly isn't standing in the circle with you. I understand the benefit of standing together, but not if you're going to add an exception for someone talking on a phone from anywhere in the world. Physical alignment is a great metaphor for team alignment, and therefore physical absence shows me someone cares more about sitting on their porch with their dog than being part of the team at work.
- high_derivative 7y agoI found the best response to standups in a prior job was to randomise a delay about ongoing work. Simply talk about what you did 2-5 days ago (depending on urgency of things). This obfuscates your exact productivity and takes away organisational power from micro-managing bosses. Whenever a manager comes in or there is a meeting to check on your progress, you can slice of something from your buffer to present. For every problem you present (from few days) ago, you can already present the solution. Or, in other words: Your productivity is some process that you don't want to be observed directly by your manager, because you will suffer negative consequences from them detecting the exact amplitudes. You simply apply non-stationary smoothing to it.
- pertymcpert 7y agoVery clever.
- amflare 7y agoHow do you prevent commit timestamps or completed tickets from giving you away?
- rozap 7y agoLots of times, the folks micromanaging aren't the ones looking at git.
- PikachuEXE 7y agoI am so glad I am not in a company that does standup Coz I am the tech lead hahahahaha
- adenverd 7y agoEngineering manager here. I think a lot of people miss the point of standup, or abuse it to somehow micromanage engineers. Standup is for the team, not the manager or PM. It serves multiple functions, but the most important is the last bit: "are you blocked by something?". Most of the time, someone else on the team knows how to unblock you. Other times, your manager is better positioned to get you what you need than you are. Most of us don't care when you work, or how much progress you made today, or whatever. Our job is to keep the ball rolling, not manage your time. The status update portion exists so that your manager doesn't randomize you in the middle of the day asking about that thing you're working on. Not because s/he thinks you're slacking, but because your work ties into a bunch of other work that's going on, and it's the manager's job to coordinate. While you may be more effective working as an information silo, your team and org are hindered by it.
- mnm1 7y ago> Standup is for the team, not the manager or PM. Nope. Never once in my career have I been at a standup that was useful to me (a contributing or leading member of the team) and that wasn't simply for the manager. Your second paragraph also contradicts the first. Is it for the manager or not? Cause it sure as hell is not for the team members who are bored out of their minds listening to the other people on their team speak about their work that 99.9% of the time is completely irrelevant to one's own. This is the reality form the IC side. Maybe managers should wise up to it and stop wasting our time.
- machinelearning 7y agoStandups are an extreme lack of parsimony. IMO, weekly 1:1s and biweekly roundtable meetings are the right quanta to compress work into so that its relevant to the respective audiences. Most people learn to bullshit and zone out during standups. Daily standups don't make sense in anything but a rare and specific tight deadline.
- machinelearning 7y agoIME standups are not even effective in unblocking most people. Why would someone want to admit they're blocked by something in front of everyone? Someone else will inevitably proclaim that they have the solution, however simple it may be, and make the asker look stupid while elevating themselves. Most people know who to ask to be unblocked or can ask their manager. 1:1s are the time to sync with regards to status on projects not in the middle of the day. Weekly roundtable meetings are the time to sync up with the rest of the team and learn what everyone is working on. The only purpose of standups is to slavedrive people into "productivity", which inevitably ends up with them thinking of how to hyperbolize whatever they're working on minutes before standup begins. Its useless.