4 ms·

One experiment [1] with rats, which made sense to me, went like this: Some rats got a lot of sugar and did not gain weight. Another group got a lot a fat and ga

One experiment [1] with rats, which made sense to me, went like this: Some rats got a lot of sugar and did not gain weight. Another group got a lot a fat and gained some weight. A third group got a 50:50 ratio of sugar and fat and gained a substantial amount of weight. This is one of the reasons why some people (like me) can eat cake made of 50% sugar and butter nearly endlessly. It's an unnatural combination and somehow transitions our brains into zombie mode where we never feel satiated. For that reason you can find that combination in a lot of processed food... [1] https://biology.stackexchange.com/questions/43673/5050-sugar-fat-mixture https://biology.stackexchange.com/questions/43673/5050-sugar...

dehrmann 7y ago
Put a bag of sugar in front of me, meh. Or a stick of butter, meh. Those sugar-butter coated cashews from Trader Joe's (or just caramel) and I'll eat half the bag.
jdm2212 7y ago
Sugar in isolation makes me feel lightheaded and a bit nauseous. Fat in isolation fills me up immediately. But together... yeah, I'll take that second (and third, and fourth) slice of cake.
chrisco255 7y ago
Rat metabolism and human metabolism aren't 1:1 There's fundamental differences between those two species in liver function and other organs. And that study conflicts with this study, which shows a high-carb diet does have an impact on rat obesity: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4497311/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4497311/
AlexTWithBeard 7y ago
Ah, ye goode olde bliss point! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bliss_point_(food) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bliss_point_(food)
nuxi 7y ago
Mother's milk contains ~4.5% fat, ~7% sugar and ~1% protein. It's not exactly 50:50 sugar/fat ratio, but it's pretty close, so I wouldn't call the combination unnatural. Maybe we've been "trained" from birth on what the "optimal" combination is...
- gizmo686 7y ago
  I'm not sure how representative an infants metabalism is. Humans are already unique in keeping our ability to digest milk into adulthood (an adaptation that has not spread to the entire population)
- smn1234 7y ago
  isn't it intended that mother's milk helps the newborn put on weight (fat) and grow? That macros ratio of carb and fat is indeed interesting
  - leethargo 7y ago
    That, and support rapid brain development (based on glucose).
- CPLX 7y ago
  As a general rule, for mammals, the natural period of milk consumption is one where the recipients weight increases by several hundred percent.
SketchySeaBeast 7y ago
That doesn't quiet work for people though - Marshmallow is nearly 100% sugar and Cotton candy is 100% sugar and I will happily eat either of those. I also won't eat a 50/50 lard/sugar mix. It's the fact that processing the food made it more palatable.
- dkarl 7y ago
  Buttered, salted popcorn is "unprocessed" by the standards here. It's a whole grain, mechanically churned cow's milk, and a mineral you can scrape off the ground in many places. All three ingredients have been consumed for thousands of years and over that time have only been altered by selective breeding (assuming you buy the non-GMO stuff.) Despite being "unprocessed," it provides poor nutrition and hits the right buttons for compulsive overconsumption.
  - SketchySeaBeast 7y ago
    You're right, but in their raw, raw format it wouldn't work. The only piece of that that's an issue is the butter. I doubt you could eat enough salt or popcorn to get fat off either. It's the processed animal milk that's the real winner. Now this doesn't meet the "ultraprocessed" spec at all, but the processed bit is the one that's the actually an issue, especially when combined with the salt. I doubt cow's milk and popcorn would have that effect.
    - pas 7y ago
      Popcorn is full of grains, which are rather energy dense, even if after popping they gain volume. Just as eating whole cobs of corn will make you full fast (partly due to the water content). Salt makes things tastier (works for the traditional corn too), which leads to eating more.
    - balfirevic 7y ago
      > I doubt cow's milk and popcorn would have that effect. Butter is just churned milk. If that is "processed" then everything is processed. Sea salt is processed too by that standard.
skohan 7y ago
I'm not an expert, but my understanding is that eating lots of sugar and fat is a worst-case metabolically for gaining bodyfat. Your body will prioritize sugar for energy while it's in your blood stream, so if you have lots of both, your body will just store the fat.
leethargo 7y ago
One (older) theory to support this is the Randle cycle [1], according to which, glucose and fatty acids can not be metabolized simultaneously. So, the presence of glucose will lead to any available fatty acids to be stored away. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randle_cycle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randle_cycle

dehrmann 7y ago

Put a bag of sugar in front of me, meh. Or a stick of butter, meh. Those sugar-butter coated cashews from Trader Joe's (or just caramel) and I'll eat half the bag.

jdm2212 7y ago

Sugar in isolation makes me feel lightheaded and a bit nauseous. Fat in isolation fills me up immediately. But together... yeah, I'll take that second (and third, and fourth) slice of cake.

chrisco255 7y ago

Rat metabolism and human metabolism aren't 1:1 There's fundamental differences between those two species in liver function and other organs. And that study conflicts with this study, which shows a high-carb diet does have an impact on rat obesity: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4497311/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4497311/

AlexTWithBeard 7y ago

Ah, ye goode olde bliss point! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bliss_point_(food) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bliss_point_(food)

nuxi 7y ago

Mother's milk contains ~4.5% fat, ~7% sugar and ~1% protein. It's not exactly 50:50 sugar/fat ratio, but it's pretty close, so I wouldn't call the combination unnatural. Maybe we've been "trained" from birth on what the "optimal" combination is...

gizmo686 7y ago
I'm not sure how representative an infants metabalism is. Humans are already unique in keeping our ability to digest milk into adulthood (an adaptation that has not spread to the entire population)
smn1234 7y ago
isn't it intended that mother's milk helps the newborn put on weight (fat) and grow? That macros ratio of carb and fat is indeed interesting
- leethargo 7y ago
  That, and support rapid brain development (based on glucose).
CPLX 7y ago
As a general rule, for mammals, the natural period of milk consumption is one where the recipients weight increases by several hundred percent.

SketchySeaBeast 7y ago

That doesn't quiet work for people though - Marshmallow is nearly 100% sugar and Cotton candy is 100% sugar and I will happily eat either of those. I also won't eat a 50/50 lard/sugar mix. It's the fact that processing the food made it more palatable.

dkarl 7y ago
Buttered, salted popcorn is "unprocessed" by the standards here. It's a whole grain, mechanically churned cow's milk, and a mineral you can scrape off the ground in many places. All three ingredients have been consumed for thousands of years and over that time have only been altered by selective breeding (assuming you buy the non-GMO stuff.) Despite being "unprocessed," it provides poor nutrition and hits the right buttons for compulsive overconsumption.
- SketchySeaBeast 7y ago
  You're right, but in their raw, raw format it wouldn't work. The only piece of that that's an issue is the butter. I doubt you could eat enough salt or popcorn to get fat off either. It's the processed animal milk that's the real winner. Now this doesn't meet the "ultraprocessed" spec at all, but the processed bit is the one that's the actually an issue, especially when combined with the salt. I doubt cow's milk and popcorn would have that effect.
  - pas 7y ago
    Popcorn is full of grains, which are rather energy dense, even if after popping they gain volume. Just as eating whole cobs of corn will make you full fast (partly due to the water content). Salt makes things tastier (works for the traditional corn too), which leads to eating more.
  - balfirevic 7y ago
    > I doubt cow's milk and popcorn would have that effect. Butter is just churned milk. If that is "processed" then everything is processed. Sea salt is processed too by that standard.

skohan 7y ago

I'm not an expert, but my understanding is that eating lots of sugar and fat is a worst-case metabolically for gaining bodyfat. Your body will prioritize sugar for energy while it's in your blood stream, so if you have lots of both, your body will just store the fat.

leethargo 7y ago

One (older) theory to support this is the Randle cycle [1], according to which, glucose and fatty acids can not be metabolized simultaneously. So, the presence of glucose will lead to any available fatty acids to be stored away. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randle_cycle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randle_cycle