3 ms·

I don't have any direct (or indirect) experience. So what happens now if a man accuses a woman of "raping" him? I'm guessing that he'd be ignored. And I don't t

I don't have any direct (or indirect) experience. So what happens now if a man accuses a woman of "raping" him? I'm guessing that he'd be ignored. And I don't think the standards will become gender-neutral any faster than they'll become just. I do wonder, though, whether young men are becoming more cautious about who they have sex with. And if there's any way to protect oneself against future rape accusations. Perhaps some sort of witnessed contractual agreement? Maybe something like Islamic "temporary marriage"? With penalties for changing ones mind later. Edit: Another thread cites an article about a guy who, paranoid after a "drunken hookup", filed a Title IX complaint.[0] So maybe that's the workable strategy. Have sex, and then be first to file. And research the process ahead of time, so there's no delay. 0) https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2018/06/title-ix-is-too-easy-to-abuse/561650/ https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2018/06/title-ix-i...

rayiner 7y ago
> I do wonder, though, whether young men are becoming more cautious about who they have sex with. This seems to be part of the point of these efforts, and also socially desirable. Don't take advantage of marginal situations; don't toe the line. Don't do anything you can't defend later. Those are all good things to tell young men.
- klipt 7y ago
  So long as it's framed in a gender neutral way, I agree. There are also young college women having sex with intoxicated men, and their gender shouldn't be a factor in whether or not they get expelled.
- mirimir 7y ago
  Yes, of course. I do get that rape used to be almost accepted. Or getting women intoxicated enough, voluntarily, that they'd want to have sex. Or at least, wouldn't remember that they didn't want to have sex. Or just plain seduction. Getting women excited enough that they'd want to have sex. I recall an intimate conversation with a female friend, who shared that she'd never let a guy touch her breasts, unless she wanted to have sex. Because once she did, and he did, she would. Even that could be borderline, if there's a premeditated intent to seduce. Yet seduction is often a consensual process. But maybe not consensually with the goal of sex. And there's where it gets crazy. Anyway, I was thinking more about being cautious regarding sexual politics. As in researching the potential partner's social media history. Or just introducing the issue in a casual way, and seeing what they say.
gm678 7y ago
" So what happens now if a man accuses a woman of "raping" him? I'm guessing that he'd be ignored. " I do think there is currently a double standard, and I think that misogyny and the view of women as "passive" participants in sex contributes to that. The CDC estimates that 1 in 71 men will be raped in their lifetime, and an analysis by Scientific American found that 79 percent of male victims of rape reported it to police, but unfortunately I cannot find information on how many of those reports led to a trial and potentially a conviction. I think that while some men are likely ignored, and we definitely have a problem with the way we imagine sexual assault as a society, the relatively high reporting rate suggests that many cases are also taken seriously. I'm also not really sure what "strategy" you're referring to; a strategy to protect yourself from Title IX complaints? I really think that what rayiner said is all you need to do: "Don't take advantage of marginal situations; don't toe the line. Don't do anything you can't defend later." https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/sexual-victimization-by-women-is-more-common-than-previously-known/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/sexual-victimizat...
- klipt 7y ago
  > The CDC estimates that 1 in 71 men will be raped in their lifetime For men the category you want to look at is "made to penetrate". For CDC data the "rape" category only counts victims being penetrated, so if a woman forces a man to have sex with her that is instead counted under "made to penetrate".
- mirimir 7y ago
  Regarding strategy, I was suggesting that the man file a Title IX complaint before the woman does, just in case. It could also be pursued as a consciousness-raising campaign. And what you say about avoiding what you "can't defend later" seems disingenuous. Because from TFA, I gather that there's typically no mechanism for making a defense.
- 0xcraft 7y ago
  My experience relating being raped to friends was generally not a positive one. I found women tended to be more open to believing my story. Men were pretty skeptical. Of course, sharing my experience didn't happen for many years. In the mid 1980s the idea that men even could be raped by a woman was a bit farfetched both socially and legally.

rayiner 7y ago

> I do wonder, though, whether young men are becoming more cautious about who they have sex with. This seems to be part of the point of these efforts, and also socially desirable. Don't take advantage of marginal situations; don't toe the line. Don't do anything you can't defend later. Those are all good things to tell young men.

klipt 7y ago
So long as it's framed in a gender neutral way, I agree. There are also young college women having sex with intoxicated men, and their gender shouldn't be a factor in whether or not they get expelled.
mirimir 7y ago
Yes, of course. I do get that rape used to be almost accepted. Or getting women intoxicated enough, voluntarily, that they'd want to have sex. Or at least, wouldn't remember that they didn't want to have sex. Or just plain seduction. Getting women excited enough that they'd want to have sex. I recall an intimate conversation with a female friend, who shared that she'd never let a guy touch her breasts, unless she wanted to have sex. Because once she did, and he did, she would. Even that could be borderline, if there's a premeditated intent to seduce. Yet seduction is often a consensual process. But maybe not consensually with the goal of sex. And there's where it gets crazy. Anyway, I was thinking more about being cautious regarding sexual politics. As in researching the potential partner's social media history. Or just introducing the issue in a casual way, and seeing what they say.

gm678 7y ago

" So what happens now if a man accuses a woman of "raping" him? I'm guessing that he'd be ignored. " I do think there is currently a double standard, and I think that misogyny and the view of women as "passive" participants in sex contributes to that. The CDC estimates that 1 in 71 men will be raped in their lifetime, and an analysis by Scientific American found that 79 percent of male victims of rape reported it to police, but unfortunately I cannot find information on how many of those reports led to a trial and potentially a conviction. I think that while some men are likely ignored, and we definitely have a problem with the way we imagine sexual assault as a society, the relatively high reporting rate suggests that many cases are also taken seriously. I'm also not really sure what "strategy" you're referring to; a strategy to protect yourself from Title IX complaints? I really think that what rayiner said is all you need to do: "Don't take advantage of marginal situations; don't toe the line. Don't do anything you can't defend later." https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/sexual-victimization-by-women-is-more-common-than-previously-known/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/sexual-victimizat...

klipt 7y ago
> The CDC estimates that 1 in 71 men will be raped in their lifetime For men the category you want to look at is "made to penetrate". For CDC data the "rape" category only counts victims being penetrated, so if a woman forces a man to have sex with her that is instead counted under "made to penetrate".
mirimir 7y ago
Regarding strategy, I was suggesting that the man file a Title IX complaint before the woman does, just in case. It could also be pursued as a consciousness-raising campaign. And what you say about avoiding what you "can't defend later" seems disingenuous. Because from TFA, I gather that there's typically no mechanism for making a defense.
0xcraft 7y ago
My experience relating being raped to friends was generally not a positive one. I found women tended to be more open to believing my story. Men were pretty skeptical. Of course, sharing my experience didn't happen for many years. In the mid 1980s the idea that men even could be raped by a woman was a bit farfetched both socially and legally.