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This is hardly a new phenomenon. India has for the past few hundred years been run by an elite linguistic minority - the so called Macaulay's children. It's ha

This is hardly a new phenomenon. India has for the past few hundred years been run by an elite linguistic minority - the so called Macaulay's children. It's hardly a wonder that the deep state in India both despises and organizes self-righteous protests against local linguistic communities, all while simultaneously ensuring that education, the bureaucracy and employment remain isolated to English speakers. Little wonder that most of India's bright minds leave for the US right after (or even before) graduation. It's astonishing that Social 'Scientists' have paid such little attention to such glaring structural disparities (compared to say China), while they go on wrecking what's left of Indian society using theories entirely developed by foreigners. Education has definitely gone downhill as a result over the past few decades - while my parents tell us stories of great education in Public schools (run, quite sensibly, in the local languages), I can see the abysmal state of these today. The state has tried to offload its duties (while imposing one of the highest tax rates in the world) by emburdening Hindu-run schools (somehow this is 'secular') using RTE, but the competition and the fees at some of the better schools has become quite absurd of late, costing people close to ~$3000 annually, and an additional one time 'donation' which will help cut the long queues for these schools. Considering that this kind of colonial social structures are absent in most countries, it is to be expected that the Indian economy can't really outgrow its ~100 million elite, while the underclass remains bound in a sub-saharan level educational and cognitive achievements (that is if they're even literate). It is very interesting that the self-labelled "Left" in India is at the helm of further pushing these colonial policies, while the supposed "right", in their bombastic arrogance, are happy to implement them (see Shiv Sena, BJP etc., and also the DMKs in Tamil Nadu). It's very unlikely that India will ever achieve parity with China in our lifetimes, considering its self-destructive tendencies.

justforfunhere 7y ago
>>> It's very unlikely that India will ever achieve parity with China in our lifetimes, considering its self-destructive tendencies. And to add to that, we don't really exist in the most peaceful part of the world with at least two of our neighbors ( Ch, Pk ) having fought wars with us in the last fifty years.
- rapsey 7y ago
  I don't think that is all that relevant in this context (see Israel).
  - justforfunhere 7y ago
    I tend to agree with you that Israel, as a country of its size and kind of neighbors its surrounded with, is not placed very pleasantly. But it is a country far more homogeneous than India in all the respects that make a nation ( religious, social, demographically and economy wise ). As GP pointed out that India has the potential to self-implode given the inequality and poverty that has been bred for a long time ( hundreds of years ) by various rulers of the land. The self destruction reaction might just fasten up if a catalyst is provided by anyone of the hostile neighbors.
    - throwaway1777 7y ago
      Not sure about your overall points but Israel is far from homogenous with a large part of the country literally controlled by another government (Palestine).
    - QuesnayJr 7y ago
      Israel is very far from being homogeneous. It's made up of people who immigrated there from all over Europe and the Middle East. There is a big cultural divide between the people from European backgrounds and people from Middle Eastern backgrounds. It also has a significant Muslim population (17%).
  - sbmthakur 7y ago
    Israel's neighbors don't have nukes. In India's case, on one side you have a known sponsor of terror(where Osama was found) and on another side we have One Party Communist China. And the fact that they both are partnering isn't helping.
- sbmthakur 7y ago
  Both of them being nuclear powers further complicates our security situation.
aviraldg 7y ago
English is the ideal "neutral" link language for a country with as much linguistic diversity as India (thus also making it a suitable medium for education.) The alternative would be to force the whole country to learn a single language (Hindi), which is to them more foreign than English is, or to use only regional languages, making it difficult to have countrywide exams/educational content. There is nothing colonial or elite about English -- it is simply the most practical choice for a link language, given we have to learn it anyway to interact with the rest of the world.
- iamshs 7y ago
  Agreed with everything. English is single most important factor towards upward mobility. Hindi imposition will suffocate linguistic diversity. Even the Hindi cooking channels for example, have started inserting so much nationalistic and religious issues in there. I just prefer Pakistani channels instead nowadays or just websites.
kamaal 7y ago
Notice how you need English education to even comment on forums like these. Now if you don't know English you just get filtered out of a lot of big things in this age. There is little you can do about it, because the west got ahead a few centuries during the industrial/renaissance age. Don't blame west for anything, because our country was reasonably well off. It has warm tropical weather with 12 hours of sunlight, and plenty of water with fertile soil. Plus we didn't have those bubonic plagues. Despite this the kings here barely did anything on the human resources end. Heck there isn't even a remote concept of social equity in India. Local languages can't show any miracles because you can't do any serious training or academic work with them.
- iamshs 7y ago
  The pejorative 'Macaulay's Children' should have given ample idea to where his comment was heading, and it did not disappoint.
- codeisawesome 7y ago
  This is a lot of self hate. The west got ahead in the colonial era, not just the industrial era. We had plenty of empires that worked on developing the country such as Mauryan, Maratha etc. I very much agree that a strong command over English is the only thing that can help someone in this country if they’re not born massively advantaged; but there is no need for un-true self-laceration. If I could go back in time I would definitely smack some emperors around the head for not being more exploratory on the Naval front - but our very fertile soil was our undoing - much like China, no need to go anywhere if agriculture is highly viable right where you are, and foreigners come to YOU looking to buy the nice stuff you grow (spices).
  - kamaal 7y ago
    What I wrote is a brutal self appraisal of the reality we are living through. Where we stand is a direct consequence of what we have done in the past. To verify it all we have to do is see where are today. Sorry if this offends you. But this is the reality.
sbmthakur 7y ago
> It is very interesting that the self-labelled "Left" in India is at the helm of further pushing these colonial policies.. When it comes to economy, the current Government will also fall into the "Left" category. BJP for all its talks, has done very little to take the country towards the capitalistic way. It took them years to slash the corporate tax which any economic-right government would've done long ago.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
pkphilip 7y ago
The problem has been the absolutely pitiable amount of money which is being spent on human capital by the government. The government schooling systems across the country is in a mess - and this has nothing to do with "Macaulay's children" or English because most government schools are in the vernacular language. The present government also made huge budget cuts in the mid-day meal programme which is an essential programme which draws the poor into the schools. So overall, things have gotten much worse.

justforfunhere 7y ago

>>> It's very unlikely that India will ever achieve parity with China in our lifetimes, considering its self-destructive tendencies. And to add to that, we don't really exist in the most peaceful part of the world with at least two of our neighbors ( Ch, Pk ) having fought wars with us in the last fifty years.

rapsey 7y ago
I don't think that is all that relevant in this context (see Israel).
- justforfunhere 7y ago
  I tend to agree with you that Israel, as a country of its size and kind of neighbors its surrounded with, is not placed very pleasantly. But it is a country far more homogeneous than India in all the respects that make a nation ( religious, social, demographically and economy wise ). As GP pointed out that India has the potential to self-implode given the inequality and poverty that has been bred for a long time ( hundreds of years ) by various rulers of the land. The self destruction reaction might just fasten up if a catalyst is provided by anyone of the hostile neighbors.
  - throwaway1777 7y ago
    Not sure about your overall points but Israel is far from homogenous with a large part of the country literally controlled by another government (Palestine).
  - QuesnayJr 7y ago
    Israel is very far from being homogeneous. It's made up of people who immigrated there from all over Europe and the Middle East. There is a big cultural divide between the people from European backgrounds and people from Middle Eastern backgrounds. It also has a significant Muslim population (17%).
- sbmthakur 7y ago
  Israel's neighbors don't have nukes. In India's case, on one side you have a known sponsor of terror(where Osama was found) and on another side we have One Party Communist China. And the fact that they both are partnering isn't helping.
sbmthakur 7y ago
Both of them being nuclear powers further complicates our security situation.

aviraldg 7y ago

English is the ideal "neutral" link language for a country with as much linguistic diversity as India (thus also making it a suitable medium for education.) The alternative would be to force the whole country to learn a single language (Hindi), which is to them more foreign than English is, or to use only regional languages, making it difficult to have countrywide exams/educational content. There is nothing colonial or elite about English -- it is simply the most practical choice for a link language, given we have to learn it anyway to interact with the rest of the world.

iamshs 7y ago
Agreed with everything. English is single most important factor towards upward mobility. Hindi imposition will suffocate linguistic diversity. Even the Hindi cooking channels for example, have started inserting so much nationalistic and religious issues in there. I just prefer Pakistani channels instead nowadays or just websites.

kamaal 7y ago

Notice how you need English education to even comment on forums like these. Now if you don't know English you just get filtered out of a lot of big things in this age. There is little you can do about it, because the west got ahead a few centuries during the industrial/renaissance age. Don't blame west for anything, because our country was reasonably well off. It has warm tropical weather with 12 hours of sunlight, and plenty of water with fertile soil. Plus we didn't have those bubonic plagues. Despite this the kings here barely did anything on the human resources end. Heck there isn't even a remote concept of social equity in India. Local languages can't show any miracles because you can't do any serious training or academic work with them.

iamshs 7y ago
The pejorative 'Macaulay's Children' should have given ample idea to where his comment was heading, and it did not disappoint.
codeisawesome 7y ago
This is a lot of self hate. The west got ahead in the colonial era, not just the industrial era. We had plenty of empires that worked on developing the country such as Mauryan, Maratha etc. I very much agree that a strong command over English is the only thing that can help someone in this country if they’re not born massively advantaged; but there is no need for un-true self-laceration. If I could go back in time I would definitely smack some emperors around the head for not being more exploratory on the Naval front - but our very fertile soil was our undoing - much like China, no need to go anywhere if agriculture is highly viable right where you are, and foreigners come to YOU looking to buy the nice stuff you grow (spices).
- kamaal 7y ago
  What I wrote is a brutal self appraisal of the reality we are living through. Where we stand is a direct consequence of what we have done in the past. To verify it all we have to do is see where are today. Sorry if this offends you. But this is the reality.

sbmthakur 7y ago

> It is very interesting that the self-labelled "Left" in India is at the helm of further pushing these colonial policies.. When it comes to economy, the current Government will also fall into the "Left" category. BJP for all its talks, has done very little to take the country towards the capitalistic way. It took them years to slash the corporate tax which any economic-right government would've done long ago.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

pkphilip 7y ago

The problem has been the absolutely pitiable amount of money which is being spent on human capital by the government. The government schooling systems across the country is in a mess - and this has nothing to do with "Macaulay's children" or English because most government schools are in the vernacular language. The present government also made huge budget cuts in the mid-day meal programme which is an essential programme which draws the poor into the schools. So overall, things have gotten much worse.