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This reads like blame shifting, not accountability. > Yes, this was brought to my attention as a result of the review. That review has apparently caused suffic
by Sir_Cmpwn 7y ago
This reads like blame shifting, not accountability.
> Yes, this was brought to my attention as a result of the review. That review has apparently caused sufficient damage that Raptor will now be reevaluating whether we can afford to service the individual market at this time, or whether they need to focus on business users only.
See: the review caused the damage, not Raptor's failure to provide a good support experience. In any case, if you can't handle the support load, then you're probably right in reconsidering.
I am really rooting for Raptor here, I'm not your enemy. I agree that x86 monoculture is awful for the ecosystem and ARM hardly presents anything better. This is also why I got heavily involved in RISC-V, and I wanted to find something similar in POWER9. I haven't laid hands on a working Blackbird yet but if it is as good as I hope it is, then I think you have a good shot if you just focus on scaling and fixing your support problems. If you can solve the support and get the system working, I would be thrilled to amend my review and publish a new one with all of the things I like about my shiny new Blackbird system.
> I am saddened to see x86 and locked computing profiting from this, but at the end of the day individuals have always been a difficult segment to target. They tend to want extremely low (below cost) pricing, high levels of service, and generally want to run various proprietary games on Windows while simultaneously settling for a false sense of security through open source firmware wrapping large hidden binary components. Out of sight, out of mind, purchase price above all other concerns seems to be the general takeaway for that market.
I can't claim to know what the firehose of support tickets is like, but know that there are users who don't fit this strawman. I'm one of them. I'm not here to run proprietary games on Windows. My stated goal is to promote the development of portable software and the adoption of freer systems by using my board to introduce POWER9 support to builds.sr.ht, giving access to POWER9 cycles to tens of thousands of developers. It's causes like this which help address the problems you mention of fat software needing to be improved to make alternative architectures viable. No small part of why Chromium is slow on ppc and fast on x86 is because there's a JIT for x86 and not for ppc, not necessarily because of fundamental problems in Chromium's design.
But yeah, there are fundamental problems in our entire ecosystem with respect to disreagarding performance thanks to the luxuries afforded to us by fast x86 systems. Is the answer to this that we should be writing off alternative hardware models? No, the hardware should strive to be fast and the software should strive to meet it. Both parties have a responsibility to performance and we can't lay the blame at each other's feet and ignore our role in it. It's a slow process to change the industry, we must exercise patience.
EDIT: it's been pointed out to me that Chromium has a JIT on POWER9. This doesn't substantially change my response.
- tpearson-raptor 7y ago> This reads like blame shifting, not accountability. I don't think I was clear enough here, sorry. Yes, Raptor Computing Systems is accountable for its poor support experience. Their management is trying, unsuccessfully, to manage the support load. I am actually on the engineering and technology side moreso than the support and business side, and I have no direct ability to change how support is handled beyond making (strong) recommendations. Fundamentally, however, the blame does lie primarily with consumers that are unwilling to pay for owner controlled computing. Raptor took a risk with the Blackbird, attempting to broaden the reach of owner controlled compute beyond business and high end workstation users, and fundamentally underestimated > 20x additional support load that new market would end up causing. Raptor does not have the resources to handle that kind of support load, and the increases in product pricing required to do so would put Blackbird back out of reach of everyone except business users. Raptor was working on fixing these issues regardless, but AMD Rome has made that nearly impossible due to the (predictable, but unfortunate) customer reaction that I detailed earlier. We have had to pivot to a different mechanism to try to resolve the problems, and I am not allowed to say more publicly as to what that will be at this time, other than it is coming for October.
- Sir_Cmpwn 7y agoThank you for clarifying more. Not sure if you're following IRC, but just in case I'll mention it here as well: Raptor products are already outpricing most consumers. Even in casual conversations with hacker friends, most of them balk at the price. Point being: if you increased your prices most of your buyers wouldn't blink. At present your buyers are blinking at the poor support experience. I would have paid a 50% premium for a product with actual support. A compromise would be to offer ala-carte support packages, perhaps billed yearly. I would also have paid for that. I know these decisions aren't in your court, but I don't have anyone else to share my opinion with, so there you have it. I hope that I will publish a more positive review of Raptor with these problems addressed soon. Thanks for coming by the thread to share your thoughts.
- Luke-Jr 7y agoA number of users on IRC also said they would be priced out by any 50% premium increase...