8 ms·

European here, trying to actually buy the thing. You can't. The first reservations will be fulfilled in the middle of 2020, but those will only be the mid-sized

by jwr 7y ago

European here, trying to actually buy the thing. You can't. The first reservations will be fulfilled in the middle of 2020, but those will only be the mid-sized battery versions. If you want the version with a larger battery, there is no firm ship date, but it is expected in 2021. What I find somewhat amusing is that for the past months we've been bombarded by a huge marketing campaign advertising a car that doesn't exist :-)

r00fus 7y ago
If you want an EV now, buy a Tesla/Leaf/Zoe. That's all I'm hearing from VW. I'm thrilled with my Focus EV (cause Model3 wasn't available when I bought it). I have a basket of features I'd like on my next EV that I don't have now, but it's way better than waiting for the "best" to show up.
- carlmr 7y ago
  Maybe someone wants to buy an EV now but they have no problem waiting for a year.
izacus 7y ago
That pretty much sounds like a Tesla 3 marketing campaign? :D There was a looong wait for those to start shipping too.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
wazoox 7y ago
There are already very good Korean-made electric cars for sale at roughly the same price. You don't have to wait.
- cat199 7y ago
  Are there korean made vw ID.3's for sale at roughly the same price? because that is what this person is actually talking about waiting for..
adrianmonk 7y ago
> huge marketing campaign advertising a car that doesn't exist Maybe they want to make buyers hesitate on buying a Tesla Model 3 right now and wait until next year. If you assume cars will sooner or later go electric, automakers would feel they need to capture part of that market to survive. The article says VW is making a "multibillion-dollar push", so it seems likely that's their strategy. So if all they get out of these ads is to put people into a holding pattern until 2020 to decide on VW or Tesla, that combats the threat of Tesla dominance, which in and of itself could be worth what VW spends on ads.
ratel 7y ago
The possible reason to start the campaign now is that a big chunk of the market in Europe is business lease. New vehicles are not ordered in the last quarter of the year, because the resell value will drop if the car is a year old in three months. The lead time for cars ordered by employees is a bit longer than for regular customers. By building the hype over a new affordable EV which in quite some countries come with tax brakes they probably hope people will wait for the car to come out in Q2 and not have another one delivered in Q1.
- vinay427 7y ago
  > New vehicles are not ordered in the last quarter of the year, because the resell value will drop if the car is a year old in three months. Few companies seem to bother coordinating model years with calendar years. I agree about the lead time, however.
radium3d 7y ago
I'm surprised they're advertising. They should just reveal more details slowly like Tesla. It should sell itself as they become available for test drives.
kensai 7y ago
Exactly what Tesla did when it marketed the 3. Wait list. Have friends that still waiting. Perfectly normal, factories for EVs have to be built from ground up or adapted. This takes time. In the meantime, why not win hearts and minds?
- AstralStorm 7y ago
  In the meantime, you could get a few Nissan Leaf Plus - due next year most likely. And unlike VW and Tesla, Nissan has the production capacity...
- petre 7y ago
  This is a bit like the 80s in communist countries: you'd wait for years on a waiting list to be able to buy a car.
snsr 7y ago
I love it, but I don’t think these are even coming to the North American market.
- electriclove 7y ago
  Which begs the question.. why not? They would sell incredibly well. Things like this continue to make me question how committed these legacy automakers truly are in regarding to making and selling EVs.
  - elihu 7y ago
    Possibly they're constrained by battery supply, or maybe they don't think they can ramp up production fast enough to supply all markets at once. We'll know they're really committed when they stop making gas/diesel cars (which they've said they're planning to do eventually).
    - NotSammyHagar 7y ago
      Of course they are constrained by battery supply as a primary reason. The second reason is EVERY SINGLE EV hurts their dealers, because the maintenance is so much less. No spark plugs, mufflers, less use of brakes because of regen, no tune ups. They can still go wrong but so much is not needed in evs. Dealers make most of their profits from maintenance, and thus - they don't want them.
      - AstralStorm 7y ago
        No, maintenance is generally done by separate auto shops. These do sometimes license the brand to become "authorized" but they definitely have nothing to do with car dealership.
        NotSammyHagar 7y ago
        Sorry but i disagree, this is widely known. A neutral article says half of dealer profit comes from maintenance. It doesn't matter that a lot of maintenance comes from outside shops. At the dealer, lots of profit comes from maintenance and that's drastically reduced with evs. https://www.edmunds.com/car-buying/where-does-the-car-dealer-make-money.html https://www.edmunds.com/car-buying/where-does-the-car-dealer... "So where does the majority of a dealership's profit come from? It's not from car sales, at least not directly. It's from the service and parts department, which accounts for the other 49.6% of the dealership's gross profits, according to NADA."
PorterDuff 7y ago
"huge marketing campaign advertising a car that doesn't exist" Perhaps they are trying to gauge the likely success of the car before some final production decisions are made. You do have to wonder how Tesla is going to survive the first surge of practical mass-market electric cars. They definitely are riding some sort of tiger while trying to build out marketshare, technology, infrastructure. My money is on Toyota but would be thrilled to be wrong.
- sxates 7y ago
  Tesla will be fine, for several reasons: 1. They're way ahead of everyone else in terms of energy efficiency. Compare a Model S or X to the Jaguar iPace or Audi e-tron - the Tesla gets 30-50% more range out of the same size battery. That's a big gap. 2. Super chargers - other manufacturers have to rely on really spotty networks of third-party charging stations that are unreliable, and add friction for their customers (have to have the right card and the right connector, etc.). Teslas super chargers are in all the right places, are stupid easy to use, and always work. 3. Tesla actually wants to sell EVs. The other manufacturers are hamstrung with their legacy product groups. They're just dipping their toes in the water trying to figure out how to make the transition without 'Osborning' themselves, or doing the minimum to satisfy California regulations. Tesla is all-in and innovating at a much faster pace.
  - clouddrover 7y ago
    > Tesla will be fine, for several reasons Tesla will be fine as a niche manufacturer. Jaguar's been around for a long time and they've always been a low volume manufacturer. Tesla can be the same. > 1. They're way ahead of everyone else in terms of energy efficiency. The Hyundai Kona, Kia Niro EV, and the Kia Soul EV all achieve good range at a lower price point than Tesla offers. > 2. Super chargers - other manufacturers have to rely on really spotty networks of third-party charging stations that are unreliable Ionity in Europe is a joint venture between many manufacturers. Hyundai just recently joined: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/hyundai-kia-ionity-electric-car-charging/ https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/hyundai-kia-ionity-electr... Electrify America, EVgo, and ChargePoint now have roaming agreements which simplify charging for their users and makes the separate CCS networks act more like one large CCS network: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/evgo-electrify-america-charging-station/ https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/evgo-electrify-america-ch... Mercedes in Europe has agreements with the European charging networks to allow all charging billing to be done through the owner's Mercedes Me account. At this point it would be much better if Tesla switched their chargers and cars to CCS instead of persisting with a proprietary plug. If Tesla is interested in promoting EV usage (which they claim is their mission) then they will also allow all EVs to charge at their chargers, just like Teslas can charge at CCS chargers today. > 3. Tesla actually wants to sell EVs. Volkswagen has invested more money into EVs than anyone: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-volkswagen-electric-insight-idUSKCN1PV0K4 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-volkswagen-electric-insig...
rasz 7y ago
>huge marketing campaign advertising a car that doesn't exist Audi did the same thing. I think they do it for the green image, not sales.

by jwr 7y ago

r00fus 7y ago

If you want an EV now, buy a Tesla/Leaf/Zoe. That's all I'm hearing from VW. I'm thrilled with my Focus EV (cause Model3 wasn't available when I bought it). I have a basket of features I'd like on my next EV that I don't have now, but it's way better than waiting for the "best" to show up.

carlmr 7y ago
Maybe someone wants to buy an EV now but they have no problem waiting for a year.

izacus 7y ago

That pretty much sounds like a Tesla 3 marketing campaign? :D There was a looong wait for those to start shipping too.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

wazoox 7y ago

There are already very good Korean-made electric cars for sale at roughly the same price. You don't have to wait.

cat199 7y ago
Are there korean made vw ID.3's for sale at roughly the same price? because that is what this person is actually talking about waiting for..

adrianmonk 7y ago

> huge marketing campaign advertising a car that doesn't exist Maybe they want to make buyers hesitate on buying a Tesla Model 3 right now and wait until next year. If you assume cars will sooner or later go electric, automakers would feel they need to capture part of that market to survive. The article says VW is making a "multibillion-dollar push", so it seems likely that's their strategy. So if all they get out of these ads is to put people into a holding pattern until 2020 to decide on VW or Tesla, that combats the threat of Tesla dominance, which in and of itself could be worth what VW spends on ads.

ratel 7y ago

The possible reason to start the campaign now is that a big chunk of the market in Europe is business lease. New vehicles are not ordered in the last quarter of the year, because the resell value will drop if the car is a year old in three months. The lead time for cars ordered by employees is a bit longer than for regular customers. By building the hype over a new affordable EV which in quite some countries come with tax brakes they probably hope people will wait for the car to come out in Q2 and not have another one delivered in Q1.

vinay427 7y ago
> New vehicles are not ordered in the last quarter of the year, because the resell value will drop if the car is a year old in three months. Few companies seem to bother coordinating model years with calendar years. I agree about the lead time, however.

radium3d 7y ago

I'm surprised they're advertising. They should just reveal more details slowly like Tesla. It should sell itself as they become available for test drives.

kensai 7y ago

Exactly what Tesla did when it marketed the 3. Wait list. Have friends that still waiting. Perfectly normal, factories for EVs have to be built from ground up or adapted. This takes time. In the meantime, why not win hearts and minds?

AstralStorm 7y ago
In the meantime, you could get a few Nissan Leaf Plus - due next year most likely. And unlike VW and Tesla, Nissan has the production capacity...
petre 7y ago
This is a bit like the 80s in communist countries: you'd wait for years on a waiting list to be able to buy a car.

snsr 7y ago

I love it, but I don’t think these are even coming to the North American market.

electriclove 7y ago
Which begs the question.. why not? They would sell incredibly well. Things like this continue to make me question how committed these legacy automakers truly are in regarding to making and selling EVs.
- elihu 7y ago
  Possibly they're constrained by battery supply, or maybe they don't think they can ramp up production fast enough to supply all markets at once. We'll know they're really committed when they stop making gas/diesel cars (which they've said they're planning to do eventually).
  - NotSammyHagar 7y ago
    Of course they are constrained by battery supply as a primary reason. The second reason is EVERY SINGLE EV hurts their dealers, because the maintenance is so much less. No spark plugs, mufflers, less use of brakes because of regen, no tune ups. They can still go wrong but so much is not needed in evs. Dealers make most of their profits from maintenance, and thus - they don't want them.
    - AstralStorm 7y ago
      No, maintenance is generally done by separate auto shops. These do sometimes license the brand to become "authorized" but they definitely have nothing to do with car dealership.
      - NotSammyHagar 7y ago
        Sorry but i disagree, this is widely known. A neutral article says half of dealer profit comes from maintenance. It doesn't matter that a lot of maintenance comes from outside shops. At the dealer, lots of profit comes from maintenance and that's drastically reduced with evs. https://www.edmunds.com/car-buying/where-does-the-car-dealer-make-money.html https://www.edmunds.com/car-buying/where-does-the-car-dealer... "So where does the majority of a dealership's profit come from? It's not from car sales, at least not directly. It's from the service and parts department, which accounts for the other 49.6% of the dealership's gross profits, according to NADA."

PorterDuff 7y ago

"huge marketing campaign advertising a car that doesn't exist" Perhaps they are trying to gauge the likely success of the car before some final production decisions are made. You do have to wonder how Tesla is going to survive the first surge of practical mass-market electric cars. They definitely are riding some sort of tiger while trying to build out marketshare, technology, infrastructure. My money is on Toyota but would be thrilled to be wrong.

sxates 7y ago
Tesla will be fine, for several reasons: 1. They're way ahead of everyone else in terms of energy efficiency. Compare a Model S or X to the Jaguar iPace or Audi e-tron - the Tesla gets 30-50% more range out of the same size battery. That's a big gap. 2. Super chargers - other manufacturers have to rely on really spotty networks of third-party charging stations that are unreliable, and add friction for their customers (have to have the right card and the right connector, etc.). Teslas super chargers are in all the right places, are stupid easy to use, and always work. 3. Tesla actually wants to sell EVs. The other manufacturers are hamstrung with their legacy product groups. They're just dipping their toes in the water trying to figure out how to make the transition without 'Osborning' themselves, or doing the minimum to satisfy California regulations. Tesla is all-in and innovating at a much faster pace.
- clouddrover 7y ago
  > Tesla will be fine, for several reasons Tesla will be fine as a niche manufacturer. Jaguar's been around for a long time and they've always been a low volume manufacturer. Tesla can be the same. > 1. They're way ahead of everyone else in terms of energy efficiency. The Hyundai Kona, Kia Niro EV, and the Kia Soul EV all achieve good range at a lower price point than Tesla offers. > 2. Super chargers - other manufacturers have to rely on really spotty networks of third-party charging stations that are unreliable Ionity in Europe is a joint venture between many manufacturers. Hyundai just recently joined: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/hyundai-kia-ionity-electric-car-charging/ https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/hyundai-kia-ionity-electr... Electrify America, EVgo, and ChargePoint now have roaming agreements which simplify charging for their users and makes the separate CCS networks act more like one large CCS network: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/evgo-electrify-america-charging-station/ https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/evgo-electrify-america-ch... Mercedes in Europe has agreements with the European charging networks to allow all charging billing to be done through the owner's Mercedes Me account. At this point it would be much better if Tesla switched their chargers and cars to CCS instead of persisting with a proprietary plug. If Tesla is interested in promoting EV usage (which they claim is their mission) then they will also allow all EVs to charge at their chargers, just like Teslas can charge at CCS chargers today. > 3. Tesla actually wants to sell EVs. Volkswagen has invested more money into EVs than anyone: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-volkswagen-electric-insight-idUSKCN1PV0K4 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-volkswagen-electric-insig...

rasz 7y ago

>huge marketing campaign advertising a car that doesn't exist Audi did the same thing. I think they do it for the green image, not sales.