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> strength is taken to be the alcoholic strength by volume as indicated by the mark or label This phrasing frustrates me quite a bit. I assume they're referrin

by eyegor 7y ago

> strength is taken to be the alcoholic strength by volume as indicated by the mark or label This phrasing frustrates me quite a bit. I assume they're referring to "% concentration of ethanol by volume", but they chose to express it in this obtuse "units" and "strength" nomenclature. (Or is this referring to the "proof" as the strength in their formula? Is that metric used in Scotland?)

kdmccormick 7y ago
As Symbiote explains above, units are just (volume * %ABV) expressed in a standard unit -- centiliters. It seems like a great system... it's like "standard drinks" in the US but actually printed on bottles. I imagine removing the need for people to do multiplication in order to figure out how much they are drinking is probably a good thing.
- kerkeslager 7y ago
  Units are centilitres, so why not just say centilitres? If the intent is to communicate to the public, this is not an effective way to do it.
  - rleigh 7y ago
    It's absolutely effective. Much of the public aren't as educated as we might like, and communication needs to be as simple as possible. Using units of measure will only serve to confuse, because it adds additional complexity in interpreting the advice. "Units" reduce the complexity to a single number. For most drinks it will be 1, 2 or 3 units. Simple numbers, single digits. General health advice will state that n units are the maximum recommended per week or day for men or for women. It's a single number to remember. Make sure the drinks you have total less than that maximum number, and you'll be following the recommendations. The aim here isn't to be scientifically accurate. It's to reduce the problem to its essentials so that the message is clear and simple, and everyone in the entire population can understand it and follow it. By that measure, it's wildly successful.
    - kerkeslager 7y ago
      > Using units of measure will only serve to confuse, because it adds additional complexity in interpreting the advice. Units are an unit of measure. It's literally a different name for a centilitre. > "Units" reduce the complexity to a single number. For most drinks it will be 1, 2 or 3 units. Simple numbers, single digits. Centilitres reduce the complexity to a single number. For most drinks it would be 1, 2, or 3 centilitres. Simple numbers, single digits. > General health advice will state that n units are the maximum recommended per week or day for men or for women. It's a single number to remember. Make sure the drinks you have total less than that maximum number, and you'll be following the recommendations. General health advice will state that n centilitres are the maximum recommended per week or day for men or for women. It's a single number to remember. Make sure the drinks you have total less than that maximum number, and you'll be following the recommendations.
  - Normal_gaussian 7y ago
    Its incredibly effective. One shot is one unit. One beer is 2-3 units. One glass of wine is 2-3 units. It is very simple maths. The kind you find hard to mess up when drinking.
    - kerkeslager 7y ago
      It's incredibly ineffective, or people wouldn't be asking so many questions about it on this thread. One shot is one centilitre. One beer is 2-3 centilitres. One glass of wine is 2-3 centilitres. It's not maths at all, it's just communication. There's nothing "simpler" about "unit" than "centilitre", it's just less clear.
      - XJ6 7y ago
        People asking questions are being obtuse and also clearly aren't in the UK where this legislation is aimed. It would be like a continental European going to America and going, "What are all these MILES things? It's confusing!".
        kerkeslager 7y ago
        I'm an American, and miles are confusing.
nmeofthestate 7y ago
A "unit" is a specific amount of alcohol though. Not very obtuse if you are familiar with it, and know that, for example, a pint of session ale is around a couple of units. The minimum price is applied per alcohol unit.
dagw 7y ago
A 'unit' in Scotland/UK is 1cl of pure alcohol. So to get the number of 'units' of alcohol you multiply the the 'strength', in % ethanol by volum, by the volume of the container it is sold in. So a 1 liter bottle of vodka is 1l x 40% = 40 units and a bottle of wine in 0.75 x 13% = 9.75 units.

by eyegor 7y ago

kdmccormick 7y ago

As Symbiote explains above, units are just (volume * %ABV) expressed in a standard unit -- centiliters. It seems like a great system... it's like "standard drinks" in the US but actually printed on bottles. I imagine removing the need for people to do multiplication in order to figure out how much they are drinking is probably a good thing.

kerkeslager 7y ago
Units are centilitres, so why not just say centilitres? If the intent is to communicate to the public, this is not an effective way to do it.
- rleigh 7y ago
  It's absolutely effective. Much of the public aren't as educated as we might like, and communication needs to be as simple as possible. Using units of measure will only serve to confuse, because it adds additional complexity in interpreting the advice. "Units" reduce the complexity to a single number. For most drinks it will be 1, 2 or 3 units. Simple numbers, single digits. General health advice will state that n units are the maximum recommended per week or day for men or for women. It's a single number to remember. Make sure the drinks you have total less than that maximum number, and you'll be following the recommendations. The aim here isn't to be scientifically accurate. It's to reduce the problem to its essentials so that the message is clear and simple, and everyone in the entire population can understand it and follow it. By that measure, it's wildly successful.
  - kerkeslager 7y ago
    > Using units of measure will only serve to confuse, because it adds additional complexity in interpreting the advice. Units are an unit of measure. It's literally a different name for a centilitre. > "Units" reduce the complexity to a single number. For most drinks it will be 1, 2 or 3 units. Simple numbers, single digits. Centilitres reduce the complexity to a single number. For most drinks it would be 1, 2, or 3 centilitres. Simple numbers, single digits. > General health advice will state that n units are the maximum recommended per week or day for men or for women. It's a single number to remember. Make sure the drinks you have total less than that maximum number, and you'll be following the recommendations. General health advice will state that n centilitres are the maximum recommended per week or day for men or for women. It's a single number to remember. Make sure the drinks you have total less than that maximum number, and you'll be following the recommendations.
- Normal_gaussian 7y ago
  Its incredibly effective. One shot is one unit. One beer is 2-3 units. One glass of wine is 2-3 units. It is very simple maths. The kind you find hard to mess up when drinking.
  - kerkeslager 7y ago
    It's incredibly ineffective, or people wouldn't be asking so many questions about it on this thread. One shot is one centilitre. One beer is 2-3 centilitres. One glass of wine is 2-3 centilitres. It's not maths at all, it's just communication. There's nothing "simpler" about "unit" than "centilitre", it's just less clear.
    - XJ6 7y ago
      People asking questions are being obtuse and also clearly aren't in the UK where this legislation is aimed. It would be like a continental European going to America and going, "What are all these MILES things? It's confusing!".
      - kerkeslager 7y ago
        I'm an American, and miles are confusing.

nmeofthestate 7y ago

A "unit" is a specific amount of alcohol though. Not very obtuse if you are familiar with it, and know that, for example, a pint of session ale is around a couple of units. The minimum price is applied per alcohol unit.

dagw 7y ago

A 'unit' in Scotland/UK is 1cl of pure alcohol. So to get the number of 'units' of alcohol you multiply the the 'strength', in % ethanol by volum, by the volume of the container it is sold in. So a 1 liter bottle of vodka is 1l x 40% = 40 units and a bottle of wine in 0.75 x 13% = 9.75 units.