4 ms·

Makes sense to go single payer (and I tend to be pretty libertarian over all). Insurance is about having a pool of payers large enough for offsetting costs. The

Makes sense to go single payer (and I tend to be pretty libertarian over all). Insurance is about having a pool of payers large enough for offsetting costs. The larger the pool in a nation with population growth the higher probability that a larger pool will be better. The largest pool is everyone. I don’t like calling it a human right. That implies the doctors are enslaved to provide care. No rational and highly intelligent person will pursue medicine as a career if it’s going to require 12 years of education before conscription into unpaid labor.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
blackflame7000 7y ago
I like your argument, my only concern is that the government also operates the VA and the DMV which doesn't give me much confidence. The problem is also on the cost side of things. Hospitals charge astronomical for basic things like saline solution ($595 with insurance from personal experience). We have to get costs down because both of these industries are enriching themselves by privately negotiating rates.
seppin 7y ago
> Makes sense to go single payer Government as a single buyer of services from private health care providers. What's the problem?
Ididntdothis 7y ago
Somehow other countries have figured it out. Europe has a wide variety of systems from mostly private to completely public but none is even remotely as insane as the US.
Frondo 7y ago
Of course they would be paid, just like doctors are paid everywhere there's universal health care available. Access to a functioning justice system, as it ensures everyone access to laws, is arguably a human right, and yet no one ever says police, judges, or public defenders are slaves. Why is health care different?
hwillis 7y ago
> I don’t like calling it a human right. That implies the doctors are enslaved to provide care. No rational and highly intelligent person will pursue medicine as a career if it’s going to require 12 years of education before conscription into unpaid labor. That's a ridiculous Shapiro-esque take. Are programmers enslaved by accessibility requirements? Are constructors and building owners enslaved by handicapped bathrooms and wheelchair ramps? Not to mention, the thing you're describing already exists and is one of the least controversial parts of healthcare. Doctors are required to provide care, even above and beyond the Hippocratic oath. They cannot discriminate against their patients in many circumstances. Generally this is agreed to be a good thing. Healthcare as a human right does not mean that people are forced to become doctors and forced to provide care. It means that the available care should be distributed to everyone, just like the ADA means that available resources must also be distributed to give some level of equity to people born with disabilities. All humans deserve an equal footing, and should not be responsible for bad things happening to them which are not their fault. Disabilities are an obvious and clear example of that. Healthcare is similar. I have no particular stance on healthcare as a human right but you're being atrociously uncharitable in representing it.
specialist 7y ago
"...tend to be pretty libertarian over all" How do libertarians square their notion of freedom from coercion with their embrace of winner takes all economics? Best as I can tell, the two are mutually exclusive.

deleted 7y ago

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blackflame7000 7y ago

I like your argument, my only concern is that the government also operates the VA and the DMV which doesn't give me much confidence. The problem is also on the cost side of things. Hospitals charge astronomical for basic things like saline solution ($595 with insurance from personal experience). We have to get costs down because both of these industries are enriching themselves by privately negotiating rates.

seppin 7y ago

> Makes sense to go single payer Government as a single buyer of services from private health care providers. What's the problem?

Ididntdothis 7y ago

Somehow other countries have figured it out. Europe has a wide variety of systems from mostly private to completely public but none is even remotely as insane as the US.

Frondo 7y ago

Of course they would be paid, just like doctors are paid everywhere there's universal health care available. Access to a functioning justice system, as it ensures everyone access to laws, is arguably a human right, and yet no one ever says police, judges, or public defenders are slaves. Why is health care different?

hwillis 7y ago

> I don’t like calling it a human right. That implies the doctors are enslaved to provide care. No rational and highly intelligent person will pursue medicine as a career if it’s going to require 12 years of education before conscription into unpaid labor. That's a ridiculous Shapiro-esque take. Are programmers enslaved by accessibility requirements? Are constructors and building owners enslaved by handicapped bathrooms and wheelchair ramps? Not to mention, the thing you're describing already exists and is one of the least controversial parts of healthcare. Doctors are required to provide care, even above and beyond the Hippocratic oath. They cannot discriminate against their patients in many circumstances. Generally this is agreed to be a good thing. Healthcare as a human right does not mean that people are forced to become doctors and forced to provide care. It means that the available care should be distributed to everyone, just like the ADA means that available resources must also be distributed to give some level of equity to people born with disabilities. All humans deserve an equal footing, and should not be responsible for bad things happening to them which are not their fault. Disabilities are an obvious and clear example of that. Healthcare is similar. I have no particular stance on healthcare as a human right but you're being atrociously uncharitable in representing it.

specialist 7y ago

"...tend to be pretty libertarian over all" How do libertarians square their notion of freedom from coercion with their embrace of winner takes all economics? Best as I can tell, the two are mutually exclusive.