5 ms·

You're missing the point. There is no hack. You can claim, but in order to claim you need to provide evidence you have credit monitoring. So in order to get 31

You're missing the point. There is no hack. You can claim, but in order to claim you need to provide evidence you have credit monitoring. So in order to get 31 cents from equifax you need to prove that you're using an expensive useless service that is either provided by equifax or one of their equally useless competitors. The hacking was done in court.

sokoloff 7y ago
Creditkarma is free. Several credit cards/banks also offer free/bundled credit monitoring.
- shawnz 7y ago
  Why should it be my responsibility to monitor their services in the first place? Even if you do get free credit monitoring it's just yet another technique to shift blame on to the customer
  - fuzz4lyfe 7y ago
    It really is insane that people buy these services. Do you hire a security guard to stand in front of the bank as well?
- deepsun 7y ago
  Lenders don't look at credit karma, so they are useless, can show you any number you like.
  - sokoloff 7y ago
    The point is not whether it's good or bad; the point is that it's a free service that allows you to tell Equifax truthfully that you want the check and not their free credit monitoring.
  - tialaramex 7y ago
    That's not how this works. Credit Karma buys the data for their free product from Equifax. So if lenders look at Equifax (and they do) then that's the exact same data. You might wonder, "But if their product is free and they spend money buying the data for it, how can that make financial sense?" and that's the thing most consumers don't understand. What's better than selling advertising? Selling actual _customers_. Nobody (to a first approximation) is looking at credit scoring because they're bored, they are looking because they want to borrow money - they are potential customers for a lender. So you sign into Credit Karma and it says you're doing well, and they suggest you could get this MegaBank Gold Card. In fact, they've checked and you'll definitely qualify, no risk. You sign up, and MegaBank give Credit Karma a bunch of money for _finding them a new customer_.
    - ceejayoz 7y ago
      > Credit Karma buys the data for their free product from Equifax. Well, sorta. Credit Karma uses VantageScore 3.0 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VantageScore https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VantageScore), which is different from the various FICO offerings, sometimes substantially. VantageScore has four different generations. FICO has over sixty variants - by credit bureau, relevant industry (there is, for example, a mortgage-specific calculation), and generation (FICO 8 vs FICO 9). As a result, depending on what score offering they pull, your lender may see a number that's 100 points different than the one Credit Karma shows. > So you sign into Credit Karma and it says you're doing well, and they suggest you could get this MegaBank Gold Card. In fact, they've checked and you'll definitely qualify, no risk. This is another misconception. "Pre-approval" doesn't mean they actually ran the numbers; they just have stats on how many people with a similar VantageScore succeeded when they applied via CK's referral links. If you look closely, CK's "you're pre-approved!" tag actually has this disclaimer underneath it: "90% of pre-approved applicants get this card. Approval not guaranteed; subject to checks."
      - tialaramex 7y ago
        I can't speak directly to the US experience because it's different. However I did work for the biggest UK credit reference agency (one of Equifax's rivals) not so very long ago. In the UK there is no "FICO score" but consumers anyway believe a single three digit number "ought" to summarise their credit history and so the Credit Reference Agencies just make one up. I actually sat in on meetings when the rating were being changed where they argued about on the one hand a factor isn't relevant to most lenders any more, on the other hand consumers really _expect_ it to matter and are disappointed when it doesn't affect their score... The intended consumers of credit data here all have proprietary algorithms to target audiences (rather than any of them relying on a simplistic "score") with a binary outcome, indeed your credit might be "too good" for some offerings. A card with 0% for 12 months is not aimed at people who'll use the card for 12 months then pay off the entire balance without flinching and walk away. Definitely some of the offerings in the UK are approved based on knowing your _actual_ results in the proprietary algorithm because the card company is giving that algorithm (under legal agreement not to disclose it) to be used to ensure they only get given customers they'd accept. They're not "estimating" whether you'd be accepted. They don't want to waste their time on non-targets any more than the consumer wants to waste time applying for a card they won't get. There will be some rate of non-acceptance for other reasons, but "not credit worthy" shouldn't be on the list, that's sort of the whole rationale for this business.
- propogandist 7y ago
  CreditKarma is a data mining operation that should not be trusted with your data.
  - theferalrobot 7y ago
    Source? What data would they mining? Isn't credit data already available to the public?
    - colejohnson66 7y ago
      Ive never heard of this either. Yes, they use your data to offer you cards and they get a kickback for you signing up, but data mining?

sokoloff 7y ago

Creditkarma is free. Several credit cards/banks also offer free/bundled credit monitoring.

shawnz 7y ago
Why should it be my responsibility to monitor their services in the first place? Even if you do get free credit monitoring it's just yet another technique to shift blame on to the customer
- fuzz4lyfe 7y ago
  It really is insane that people buy these services. Do you hire a security guard to stand in front of the bank as well?
deepsun 7y ago
Lenders don't look at credit karma, so they are useless, can show you any number you like.
- sokoloff 7y ago
  The point is not whether it's good or bad; the point is that it's a free service that allows you to tell Equifax truthfully that you want the check and not their free credit monitoring.
- tialaramex 7y ago
  That's not how this works. Credit Karma buys the data for their free product from Equifax. So if lenders look at Equifax (and they do) then that's the exact same data. You might wonder, "But if their product is free and they spend money buying the data for it, how can that make financial sense?" and that's the thing most consumers don't understand. What's better than selling advertising? Selling actual _customers_. Nobody (to a first approximation) is looking at credit scoring because they're bored, they are looking because they want to borrow money - they are potential customers for a lender. So you sign into Credit Karma and it says you're doing well, and they suggest you could get this MegaBank Gold Card. In fact, they've checked and you'll definitely qualify, no risk. You sign up, and MegaBank give Credit Karma a bunch of money for _finding them a new customer_.
  - ceejayoz 7y ago
    > Credit Karma buys the data for their free product from Equifax. Well, sorta. Credit Karma uses VantageScore 3.0 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VantageScore https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VantageScore), which is different from the various FICO offerings, sometimes substantially. VantageScore has four different generations. FICO has over sixty variants - by credit bureau, relevant industry (there is, for example, a mortgage-specific calculation), and generation (FICO 8 vs FICO 9). As a result, depending on what score offering they pull, your lender may see a number that's 100 points different than the one Credit Karma shows. > So you sign into Credit Karma and it says you're doing well, and they suggest you could get this MegaBank Gold Card. In fact, they've checked and you'll definitely qualify, no risk. This is another misconception. "Pre-approval" doesn't mean they actually ran the numbers; they just have stats on how many people with a similar VantageScore succeeded when they applied via CK's referral links. If you look closely, CK's "you're pre-approved!" tag actually has this disclaimer underneath it: "90% of pre-approved applicants get this card. Approval not guaranteed; subject to checks."
    - tialaramex 7y ago
      I can't speak directly to the US experience because it's different. However I did work for the biggest UK credit reference agency (one of Equifax's rivals) not so very long ago. In the UK there is no "FICO score" but consumers anyway believe a single three digit number "ought" to summarise their credit history and so the Credit Reference Agencies just make one up. I actually sat in on meetings when the rating were being changed where they argued about on the one hand a factor isn't relevant to most lenders any more, on the other hand consumers really _expect_ it to matter and are disappointed when it doesn't affect their score... The intended consumers of credit data here all have proprietary algorithms to target audiences (rather than any of them relying on a simplistic "score") with a binary outcome, indeed your credit might be "too good" for some offerings. A card with 0% for 12 months is not aimed at people who'll use the card for 12 months then pay off the entire balance without flinching and walk away. Definitely some of the offerings in the UK are approved based on knowing your _actual_ results in the proprietary algorithm because the card company is giving that algorithm (under legal agreement not to disclose it) to be used to ensure they only get given customers they'd accept. They're not "estimating" whether you'd be accepted. They don't want to waste their time on non-targets any more than the consumer wants to waste time applying for a card they won't get. There will be some rate of non-acceptance for other reasons, but "not credit worthy" shouldn't be on the list, that's sort of the whole rationale for this business.
propogandist 7y ago
CreditKarma is a data mining operation that should not be trusted with your data.
- theferalrobot 7y ago
  Source? What data would they mining? Isn't credit data already available to the public?
  - colejohnson66 7y ago
    Ive never heard of this either. Yes, they use your data to offer you cards and they get a kickback for you signing up, but data mining?