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I think they have different applications. If I were to choose a language for writing a web service I'd use Go but if I wanted to write an opengl renderer I'd us

by notus 7y ago

I think they have different applications. If I were to choose a language for writing a web service I'd use Go but if I wanted to write an opengl renderer I'd use Rust.

CalChris 7y ago
Memory safety is Rust's hallmark. Is memory safety such a concern with opengl renderers?
- Liquid_Fire 7y ago
  Rust is more than just memory safety. For example, it also enables safe concurrency, which sounds like something you would want in a renderer.
  - falcolas 7y ago
    > it also enables safe concurrency Small correction, Rust provides a barrier against data access race conditions. It does not prevent deadlocks, cache hits/misses, work distribution bottlenecks, or any number of other concurrency issues.
- jerf 7y ago
  Graphics code has a long history of memory unsafety, in more recent years causing serious security issues when we tried to put OpenGL on the web with WebGL, resulting in every device driver bug turning into a kernel-level vulnerability in the JS code. You've got a lot of people writing code with more brains than discipline [1], writing in an environment where performance is priorities one, two, and three, writing in memory unsafe languages... yeah, memory unsafety in rendering code been a big problem for a long time. [1]: One of the most dangerous types of coder there is is the brilliant one, who has several times the working memory capacity of a normal person, and who can write 1000-line "functions" without breaking a sweat, and builds entire codebases out of such things. (Sometimes, perhaps the core loop of a program will be a bit of a monster, but the whole program isn't like that.) The cost of salvaging such things can be disturbingly close to the cost of rewriting such things, and indeed, the process for either may not be all that different.
  - PyroLagus 7y ago
    Also, even disregarding security issues. Maybe you just don't want your video game to crash during a boss fight? Memory safety isn't just important for security; it can also prevent lots of annoying bugs.

by notus 7y ago

I think they have different applications. If I were to choose a language for writing a web service I'd use Go but if I wanted to write an opengl renderer I'd use Rust.

CalChris 7y ago

Memory safety is Rust's hallmark. Is memory safety such a concern with opengl renderers?

Liquid_Fire 7y ago
Rust is more than just memory safety. For example, it also enables safe concurrency, which sounds like something you would want in a renderer.
- falcolas 7y ago
  > it also enables safe concurrency Small correction, Rust provides a barrier against data access race conditions. It does not prevent deadlocks, cache hits/misses, work distribution bottlenecks, or any number of other concurrency issues.
jerf 7y ago
Graphics code has a long history of memory unsafety, in more recent years causing serious security issues when we tried to put OpenGL on the web with WebGL, resulting in every device driver bug turning into a kernel-level vulnerability in the JS code. You've got a lot of people writing code with more brains than discipline [1], writing in an environment where performance is priorities one, two, and three, writing in memory unsafe languages... yeah, memory unsafety in rendering code been a big problem for a long time. [1]: One of the most dangerous types of coder there is is the brilliant one, who has several times the working memory capacity of a normal person, and who can write 1000-line "functions" without breaking a sweat, and builds entire codebases out of such things. (Sometimes, perhaps the core loop of a program will be a bit of a monster, but the whole program isn't like that.) The cost of salvaging such things can be disturbingly close to the cost of rewriting such things, and indeed, the process for either may not be all that different.
- PyroLagus 7y ago
  Also, even disregarding security issues. Maybe you just don't want your video game to crash during a boss fight? Memory safety isn't just important for security; it can also prevent lots of annoying bugs.