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Two months ago I went to a journey called the 'Mongol Rally' which is basically a race when you need to drive from the Czech Republic to Mongolia in a shitty ca

Two months ago I went to a journey called the 'Mongol Rally' which is basically a race when you need to drive from the Czech Republic to Mongolia in a shitty car Because I'm from Israel my team couldn't get into Iran but other teams got into Iran and all of them were extremely surprised. Iranians know how to welcome tourists, they were extremely friendly, the food is delicious, the country is beautiful, and many people are open-minded. The problem in Iran is their politicians and the image created around the radical Iranian regime

TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
Politicians are just that class of criminals we’ve regulated well enough to keep the spotlight on them. Judging an entire nation by the ugliness of its politicians would be short sighted. We, us regular folk, have more in common with each other, with our global neighbours, than we ever will the ruling class. Not every US citizen is a Trump support, and not every Trump supporter is a buffoon. And Australian and UK politics are simply too embarrassing to even mention.
- rayiner 7y ago
  That’s not true at all. The people are the ones who elect the politicians, remember? In Bangladesh where I’m from, if you’re an American tourist hanging out in areas full of western expats you might be get the wrong impression. But make no mistake. Outside those pockets, you’re in a country where 1/3 of people think people born into Muslim families should be executed if they leave Islam. 80% of women are beaten by their husbands. Where 22% of women are married by age 15. (On the flip side, many things Americans do would bring great shame to a Bangladeshi family.)
  - TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
    > That’s not true at all. The people are the ones who elect the politicians, remember? Don’t be so naive. In most democracies that I’m aware of, to win a politician only needs to win 51% of the vote. I’m in Australia and we have a preferential instant-runoff system[1] so it rapidly gets way more complicated than 51% majority, whereby most of our recent federal elections have been “won” by minority (less than 51%) parties forming a coalition. What you’re saying, then, is Bangladesh is full of savages and not to come there as a tourist, whereas it’s well know that Iran has a problematic government that frustrates it’s well educated, fairly ordinary, citizens. Edit to add: Trump didn’t win the popular vote neither; he won due to a quirk of the US electoral system. So I stand by my argument that we shouldn’t judge people by the politicians who claim to represent them. Edit to add: I just realised who I’m replying to. So now I have another question: why would you even write that? How do you get to being an appellate lawyer and think the political system wholly represents people’s beliefs? This is a genuine question. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electoral_system_of_Australia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electoral_system_of_Australia
csomar 7y ago
> The problem in Iran is their politicians and the image created around the radical Iranian regime I have another view: The problem with Iran is the USA siding with Saudi Arabia. Both Iran and S.A. are radical islamists countries (one could even argue that S.A. is worse). But somehow Iran is portrayed as evil and S.A. is given a blank check. I'm 95% certain that Iran politicians will hail U.S.A if they were to change sides.
- jaredklewis 7y ago
  > Both Iran and S.A. are radical islamists countries (one could even argue that S.A. is worse). What argument could there possibly be that Iran is “worse” than S.A.? As bad as things like human rights are in Iran, they are far worse in SA. The democracy index (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index) rates SA a half point lower than Iran, which is fairy significant. Freedom house also rates SA as less free than Iran: https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-world/2018/iran https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-world/2018/iran https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-world/2018/saudi-arabia https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-world/2018/saudi-ara... Hard to find any measure by which Iran is less humane than SA.
  - joelbluminator 7y ago
    Well Iran is anti west (especially anti U.S) and S.A is happy to cooperate with the West as long as it can keep it's current regime. So in western eyes Iran is dangerous and S.A is mostly an ally. This isn't necessarily supposed to be "fair", if Iran doesn't like the current state of affairs it can abandon it's expansionist aspirations and nuclear weapons, stop with the "Death to America" mindset and all sanctions would be removed. But the regime doesn't want to give it up.
    - skitout 7y ago
      For sure they don't want to give it up for free ! Just like any country Iran want to defend its interests, to play its hand the best it can... And leverage in many countries (now even in Africa) and the nuclear weapon are "trump card" in the game, so they reinforce it for now... They will wait for the next US election and see how they can work something after it
nabla9 7y ago
More I have studied international relations literacy, more surprised I am of how Iran is misrepresented in public. Iranian leadership is not crazy group of religious lunatics. Ayatollahs are very conservative group of politicians who use religion for political control. There is nothing there that can't be explained by normal power politics. They have goals and constraints. Their main goal internationally is to become regional power with recognized influence. They see themselves as protectors of the Shia Muslims. Destroying Israel is not any of those goals. It's more of a cynical tool to keep connections into into Shia Arabs and Palestinians. For the Shia living outside Iran (mainly Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Yemen) Iran is big brother that helps, but is often too controlling for their taste. The West has a tendency to see all Shia groups as mindless Iranian puppets. In reality it's the function of the situation and options they have. Iraqi Shia leaders have established connection with the US and are playing US and Iran for their own goals. Houthis in Yemen are not Iranian puppets. They have their own fight for their own reasons. Iran is just the only one to help them. Many IR experts see that there is possibility for "the great bargain" with Iran. It would include recognizing Iran's position as big regional power and deal with Israel. It would also diminish the position of Saudi Arabia. The conflict is between Saudi Arabia and Iran over influence is real.
- TulliusCicero 7y ago
  > Iranian leadership is not crazy group of religious lunatics. Ayatollahs are very conservative group of politicians who use religion for political control. It's not the motivation, it's the use. From a classical liberal western perspective, the government explicitly using religion for control is being a crazy religious lunatic. We're talking about a country where Islam is the official religion, renouncing it is illegal, and so is blasphemy against it. For Gods' sake, to apply to university you have to pass an exam on Islamic theology! With that as a baseline, you hardly need to go any further before you look like a completely kooky religious crazyman.
  - nabla9 7y ago
    Everything you say applies to Saudi Arabia. There is no justification to not having Iran as an ally instead of Saudi Arabia or Pakistan.
peteretep 7y ago
> but other teams got into Iran ... and lost their ability to enter the US under ESTA[0]. Thanks Obama! 0: https://nl.usembassy.gov/visas/visa-waiver-program/ https://nl.usembassy.gov/visas/visa-waiver-program/
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
air7 7y ago
Wow the Mongol Rally sounds amazing. Can I get in touch to ask you about it?
- Yuval_Halevi 7y ago
  Sure. Add me and send a message here: https://twitter.com/Yuval_Halevi https://twitter.com/Yuval_Halevi And as for proof for the reaching the Mongol Rally finish line: https://imgur.com/a/LVz4DMv https://imgur.com/a/LVz4DMv
concordDance 7y ago
The problem with Iran is US propaganda against them. Yes, there are a number of bad illiberal policies they have, but the bad is played up hugely while the good is minimized.
Markoff 7y ago
I heard this sentiment from many people though when my friend (experienced traveller) visited few months ago, he was very disappointed, saying they are even bigger cheaters than infamous Vietnamese and Indians, yeah they are smiling at you pretending to be your friend (unlike sour faces in Vietnam), but they still try to cheat you and God forbid if you disagree with their praise for the country, so now I just think of it as about another Vietnam
swat535 7y ago
As an Iranian-Canadian, it breaks my heart to hear this. I wish our country would have welcomed you with open arms. I know first hand how wonderful Israelis are, I have worked with plenty of talented Israeli software engineers as well as Jewish only owned companies. I can only hope for a future where our two countries can work hand in hand and collaborate. Perhaps my I am naive in thinking this but what else is there as opposed to strive for a better future?
hkai 7y ago
I feel it's similar to Russia, an insane regime but fantastic people and people generally seem to be smart and civilized, both in IT and outside of it.

TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago

Politicians are just that class of criminals we’ve regulated well enough to keep the spotlight on them. Judging an entire nation by the ugliness of its politicians would be short sighted. We, us regular folk, have more in common with each other, with our global neighbours, than we ever will the ruling class. Not every US citizen is a Trump support, and not every Trump supporter is a buffoon. And Australian and UK politics are simply too embarrassing to even mention.

rayiner 7y ago
That’s not true at all. The people are the ones who elect the politicians, remember? In Bangladesh where I’m from, if you’re an American tourist hanging out in areas full of western expats you might be get the wrong impression. But make no mistake. Outside those pockets, you’re in a country where 1/3 of people think people born into Muslim families should be executed if they leave Islam. 80% of women are beaten by their husbands. Where 22% of women are married by age 15. (On the flip side, many things Americans do would bring great shame to a Bangladeshi family.)
- TheSpiceIsLife 7y ago
  > That’s not true at all. The people are the ones who elect the politicians, remember? Don’t be so naive. In most democracies that I’m aware of, to win a politician only needs to win 51% of the vote. I’m in Australia and we have a preferential instant-runoff system[1] so it rapidly gets way more complicated than 51% majority, whereby most of our recent federal elections have been “won” by minority (less than 51%) parties forming a coalition. What you’re saying, then, is Bangladesh is full of savages and not to come there as a tourist, whereas it’s well know that Iran has a problematic government that frustrates it’s well educated, fairly ordinary, citizens. Edit to add: Trump didn’t win the popular vote neither; he won due to a quirk of the US electoral system. So I stand by my argument that we shouldn’t judge people by the politicians who claim to represent them. Edit to add: I just realised who I’m replying to. So now I have another question: why would you even write that? How do you get to being an appellate lawyer and think the political system wholly represents people’s beliefs? This is a genuine question. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electoral_system_of_Australia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electoral_system_of_Australia

csomar 7y ago

> The problem in Iran is their politicians and the image created around the radical Iranian regime I have another view: The problem with Iran is the USA siding with Saudi Arabia. Both Iran and S.A. are radical islamists countries (one could even argue that S.A. is worse). But somehow Iran is portrayed as evil and S.A. is given a blank check. I'm 95% certain that Iran politicians will hail U.S.A if they were to change sides.

jaredklewis 7y ago
> Both Iran and S.A. are radical islamists countries (one could even argue that S.A. is worse). What argument could there possibly be that Iran is “worse” than S.A.? As bad as things like human rights are in Iran, they are far worse in SA. The democracy index (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index) rates SA a half point lower than Iran, which is fairy significant. Freedom house also rates SA as less free than Iran: https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-world/2018/iran https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-world/2018/iran https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-world/2018/saudi-arabia https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-world/2018/saudi-ara... Hard to find any measure by which Iran is less humane than SA.
- joelbluminator 7y ago
  Well Iran is anti west (especially anti U.S) and S.A is happy to cooperate with the West as long as it can keep it's current regime. So in western eyes Iran is dangerous and S.A is mostly an ally. This isn't necessarily supposed to be "fair", if Iran doesn't like the current state of affairs it can abandon it's expansionist aspirations and nuclear weapons, stop with the "Death to America" mindset and all sanctions would be removed. But the regime doesn't want to give it up.
  - skitout 7y ago
    For sure they don't want to give it up for free ! Just like any country Iran want to defend its interests, to play its hand the best it can... And leverage in many countries (now even in Africa) and the nuclear weapon are "trump card" in the game, so they reinforce it for now... They will wait for the next US election and see how they can work something after it

nabla9 7y ago

More I have studied international relations literacy, more surprised I am of how Iran is misrepresented in public. Iranian leadership is not crazy group of religious lunatics. Ayatollahs are very conservative group of politicians who use religion for political control. There is nothing there that can't be explained by normal power politics. They have goals and constraints. Their main goal internationally is to become regional power with recognized influence. They see themselves as protectors of the Shia Muslims. Destroying Israel is not any of those goals. It's more of a cynical tool to keep connections into into Shia Arabs and Palestinians. For the Shia living outside Iran (mainly Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Yemen) Iran is big brother that helps, but is often too controlling for their taste. The West has a tendency to see all Shia groups as mindless Iranian puppets. In reality it's the function of the situation and options they have. Iraqi Shia leaders have established connection with the US and are playing US and Iran for their own goals. Houthis in Yemen are not Iranian puppets. They have their own fight for their own reasons. Iran is just the only one to help them. Many IR experts see that there is possibility for "the great bargain" with Iran. It would include recognizing Iran's position as big regional power and deal with Israel. It would also diminish the position of Saudi Arabia. The conflict is between Saudi Arabia and Iran over influence is real.

TulliusCicero 7y ago
> Iranian leadership is not crazy group of religious lunatics. Ayatollahs are very conservative group of politicians who use religion for political control. It's not the motivation, it's the use. From a classical liberal western perspective, the government explicitly using religion for control is being a crazy religious lunatic. We're talking about a country where Islam is the official religion, renouncing it is illegal, and so is blasphemy against it. For Gods' sake, to apply to university you have to pass an exam on Islamic theology! With that as a baseline, you hardly need to go any further before you look like a completely kooky religious crazyman.
- nabla9 7y ago
  Everything you say applies to Saudi Arabia. There is no justification to not having Iran as an ally instead of Saudi Arabia or Pakistan.

peteretep 7y ago

> but other teams got into Iran ... and lost their ability to enter the US under ESTA[0]. Thanks Obama! 0: https://nl.usembassy.gov/visas/visa-waiver-program/ https://nl.usembassy.gov/visas/visa-waiver-program/

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

air7 7y ago

Wow the Mongol Rally sounds amazing. Can I get in touch to ask you about it?

Yuval_Halevi 7y ago
Sure. Add me and send a message here: https://twitter.com/Yuval_Halevi https://twitter.com/Yuval_Halevi And as for proof for the reaching the Mongol Rally finish line: https://imgur.com/a/LVz4DMv https://imgur.com/a/LVz4DMv

concordDance 7y ago

The problem with Iran is US propaganda against them. Yes, there are a number of bad illiberal policies they have, but the bad is played up hugely while the good is minimized.

Markoff 7y ago

I heard this sentiment from many people though when my friend (experienced traveller) visited few months ago, he was very disappointed, saying they are even bigger cheaters than infamous Vietnamese and Indians, yeah they are smiling at you pretending to be your friend (unlike sour faces in Vietnam), but they still try to cheat you and God forbid if you disagree with their praise for the country, so now I just think of it as about another Vietnam

swat535 7y ago

As an Iranian-Canadian, it breaks my heart to hear this. I wish our country would have welcomed you with open arms. I know first hand how wonderful Israelis are, I have worked with plenty of talented Israeli software engineers as well as Jewish only owned companies. I can only hope for a future where our two countries can work hand in hand and collaborate. Perhaps my I am naive in thinking this but what else is there as opposed to strive for a better future?

hkai 7y ago

I feel it's similar to Russia, an insane regime but fantastic people and people generally seem to be smart and civilized, both in IT and outside of it.