7 ms·

The use of drones in this way by rebels makes me rethink the media image of a rebel. They are educated, lawyers, doctors, engineers.

by tdhz77 7y ago

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
algaeontoast 7y ago
Does anyone have more info on the specific kind(s) of drone used in the attack?
- avocado4 7y ago
  (removed)
  - capableweb 7y ago
    I tried quickly to find a source that confirms this since you didn't provide one but I cant find anything. Where did you get "It's Russian / Iranian technology deployed by Russian / Iranian mercenaries" from?
    - MiroF 7y ago
      https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/14/world/middleeast/saudi-arabia-refineries-drone-attack.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/14/world/middleeast/saudi-ar... for the tech claim. The "mercenaries" claim is wrong (at least in Yemen) though.
      - capableweb 7y ago
        So that link writes: "Iran has supplied drone technology to the Houthis fighting the Saudi-led coalition in Yemen, a panel of experts reported in January 2018 to the United Nations Security Council. United Nations investigators say the Houthis have since obtained a more advanced drone than those cited in that report, with a range of 930 miles, The Associated Press reported." So it's not clear if the source of the recent, more advanced drones is the same as the previous ones that the UNSC reported. Or am I missing something else from the article?
- idoubtit 7y ago
  > UN investigators have suggested that the rebels’ new UAV-X drone may have a range of up to 930 miles (1,500km) https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/14/major-saudi-arabia-oil-facilities-hit-by-drone-strikes https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/14/major-saudi-ar...
- mLuby 7y ago
  "Houthi rebels have been using drones in combat since the start of the Saudi-led war. The first appeared to be off-the-shelf, hobby-kit-style drones, but later versions have been nearly identical to Iranian models. Tehran denies supplying the rebels with weapons, but the west and Gulf Arab nations say it does." https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/14/major-saudi-arabia-oil-facilities-hit-by-drone-strikes https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/14/major-saudi-ar... Also if the drones were launched from Yemen then they've probably flown ≥700km, so I'd be surprised if they're commercial octocopters.
totalZero 7y ago
Successfully discharging a weapon that was given to you by someone else doesn't make you an engineer.
partialrecall 7y ago
It should be noted, engineers being well represented in these sort of rebel/revolutionary/terrorist organizations isn't a new phenomenon. Here is an article from a decade ago: https://slate.com/technology/2009/12/why-do-so-many-terrorists-have-engineering-degrees.html https://slate.com/technology/2009/12/why-do-so-many-terroris... The notion of terrorists as uneducated goat farmers is more a manifestation of western biases than it is an accurate representation of the truth.
- en-us 7y ago
  I see this in discussions about 9/11 all the time, where someone will express incredulity that it would be possible for a bunch of "goat farmers" to execute such a plan. But if you actually look at those terrorists, many were educated and from well-to-do families.
  - MiroF 7y ago
    Very much the same thing with the Sri Lanka attacks. I think the American public/media likes to paint everyone from the non-West as extremely backwards, when in reality I feel like everywhere in the non-West has "West"-like pockets of extreme affluence and then just huge amounts of inequality and rural poverty.
    - weberc2 7y ago
      Well, those events are anomalies. People usually are surprised by anomalies.
  - droithomme 7y ago
    Yemenis defending their country are terrorists?
    - mhkool 7y ago
      Of course not, but since Saudi Arabia is the ally of the USA, in the eyes of many the enemy of Saudi Arabia must be a bunch of terrorists instead of liberation fighters who want to get rid of a president that was appointed by Saudi Arabia.
tastroder 7y ago
While I don't disagree, I was curious how sophisticated these are compared to, say, those American freedom dispensers. The embedded video is kind of interesting, the one showcased there towards the end looks like a slightly oversized model airplane painted in military gray.
avocado4 7y ago
Yemen is a really poor country, they don't have this capability. This is a proxy war, we had a lot of them in the past 100 years.
- lacker 7y ago
  Do they really not have this capability? You can buy a decent drone off the shelf for a thousand bucks, how hard is it to strap an IED on the back?
  - bidatzi 7y ago
    With a range over 1000km?
    - iagovar 7y ago
      The drone doesn't need 1000km rage, you just need a pickup and a few people to get somewhat close.
    - hos234 7y ago
      How do they know how far the drone flew? Could be just Lawrence of Arabia on a camel crossing the desert and launching from outside the compound wall for all anyone knows.
      - bidatzi 7y ago
        Could be just that, but it doesn’t seem that’s what happened https://twitter.com/tobiaschneider/status/1172919700147396608?s=21 https://twitter.com/tobiaschneider/status/117291970014739660...
    - dragonwriter 7y ago
      The attack was, per their claim, carried out with assistance from inside Saudi Arabia. The required range is vastly smaller than 1000km.
- chvid 7y ago
idoubtit 7y ago
The so-called "rebels" represent a large part of the Yemen population, and they ruled over their country for many month, so of course some of them are educated and have access to technical ressources. From memory, here's what happened in Yemen: 1. The Arab revolt of 2011 led to the fall of the long time dictator, Saleh. 2. In 2012, a conference in Ryad, organized by the powerful neighbor Saudi Arabia, appointed a new president Hadi. He was supposed to rule 1 year, until a democratic vote elects a new president. 3. In 2015, a large part of the population was fed up with the lack of change, especially with Hadi extending its reign. The Houthis, a religious minority from the North of Yemen, overtook the capital. Hadi resigned. 4. Six month later, Hadi went to Saudi Arabia. He claimed he was still president. SA and United Emirates invaded Yemen. Supporters of Saleh joined with Houthis against the invading troops and Hadi's supporters. 5. Yemen has fallen into occupation and civil war. People suffer from hunger and lack of medicine. Saudi bombings destroyed hospitals, factories, historic sites… According to the Guardian, at least 40% of Saudi bombings had purely civilians targets. Houthis have requested help from Iran, so the war is regional.
- anigbrowl 7y ago
  A succinct and fair summary.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
TaylorAlexander 7y ago
The term “rebel” is usually used to designate someone who isn’t on our side. There’s lots of smart people who aren’t on our side.
- heartbreak 7y ago
  American southerners endearingly refer to the Confederate States Army as the “rebels.” Star Wars makes a good fictional counterpoint as well.
  - partialrecall 7y ago
    Perhaps also worth mentioning, some of the Russian Separatist forces in Donbass have adopted a flag that looks strikingly similar to CSA flag. It could be that they did this because they see themselves as rebels and therefore a famous rebel flag was fitting for them. When asked about it, they claim the similarity is coincidental. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Novorossiya#Similarity_with_%22Dixie_flag%22 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Novorossiya#Similarity...
rhegart 7y ago
Iran funds this. The advanced rockets by Hamas, the drones by the Houthi. Proxy war like usual. They are using Yemen for themselves uncaring of lives, we are killing so many innocent in Yemen. Life’s complicated but after the Iran deal, funding these groups by Iran increased significantly, and so did our subsequent killing of innocents.
- mhkool 7y ago
  I stated already in a previous comment: the Houthis are fighting for their own country. The Houthis may be helped by Iran but Iran is not commanding them. Since the Houthis fight for a Yemen without the appointed president, they fight for their own country. Saudi Arabia choose to have a war with the Houthis (not with Iran!) so this is not a proxy war at all.
- AsyncAwait 7y ago
  Iran! Of course let's mainly blame Iran, not KSA or the Western powers enabling them, this is an in depth analysis indeed.
- caoilte 7y ago
  Life is indeed complicated. What fueled Iran's involvement in Yemen was Saudia Arabia invading it. They worked very hard to keep the Houthis at arms length prior to that because as different religious sects go the only thing they really have in common is that the really nasty fundamentalist women-hating Sunni sects (ie the Saudis) hate them both for being different. And what kick started the war in Yemen? That would be a daddy's boy prince wanting to prove he could win his own war without daddy's help (that went well). None of which would happen if we didn't really enjoy selling guns to the Saudis, on account of all the money they've taken from us when they sold us oil. And we'd still be happily selling arms to the Iranian King we installed if they hadn't got sick of it and thrown us out. So this is on us. All of it.
  - rhegart 7y ago
    Mostly agree, definitely agree that Iran meddling was 100% our fault.

The use of drones in this way by rebels makes me rethink the media image of a rebel. They are educated, lawyers, doctors, engineers.

by tdhz77 7y ago

The use of drones in this way by rebels makes me rethink the media image of a rebel. They are educated, lawyers, doctors, engineers.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

algaeontoast 7y ago

Does anyone have more info on the specific kind(s) of drone used in the attack?

avocado4 7y ago
(removed)
- capableweb 7y ago
  I tried quickly to find a source that confirms this since you didn't provide one but I cant find anything. Where did you get "It's Russian / Iranian technology deployed by Russian / Iranian mercenaries" from?
  - MiroF 7y ago
    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/14/world/middleeast/saudi-arabia-refineries-drone-attack.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/14/world/middleeast/saudi-ar... for the tech claim. The "mercenaries" claim is wrong (at least in Yemen) though.
    - capableweb 7y ago
      So that link writes: "Iran has supplied drone technology to the Houthis fighting the Saudi-led coalition in Yemen, a panel of experts reported in January 2018 to the United Nations Security Council. United Nations investigators say the Houthis have since obtained a more advanced drone than those cited in that report, with a range of 930 miles, The Associated Press reported." So it's not clear if the source of the recent, more advanced drones is the same as the previous ones that the UNSC reported. Or am I missing something else from the article?
idoubtit 7y ago
> UN investigators have suggested that the rebels’ new UAV-X drone may have a range of up to 930 miles (1,500km) https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/14/major-saudi-arabia-oil-facilities-hit-by-drone-strikes https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/14/major-saudi-ar...
mLuby 7y ago
"Houthi rebels have been using drones in combat since the start of the Saudi-led war. The first appeared to be off-the-shelf, hobby-kit-style drones, but later versions have been nearly identical to Iranian models. Tehran denies supplying the rebels with weapons, but the west and Gulf Arab nations say it does." https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/14/major-saudi-arabia-oil-facilities-hit-by-drone-strikes https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/14/major-saudi-ar... Also if the drones were launched from Yemen then they've probably flown ≥700km, so I'd be surprised if they're commercial octocopters.

totalZero 7y ago

Successfully discharging a weapon that was given to you by someone else doesn't make you an engineer.

partialrecall 7y ago

It should be noted, engineers being well represented in these sort of rebel/revolutionary/terrorist organizations isn't a new phenomenon. Here is an article from a decade ago: https://slate.com/technology/2009/12/why-do-so-many-terrorists-have-engineering-degrees.html https://slate.com/technology/2009/12/why-do-so-many-terroris... The notion of terrorists as uneducated goat farmers is more a manifestation of western biases than it is an accurate representation of the truth.

en-us 7y ago
I see this in discussions about 9/11 all the time, where someone will express incredulity that it would be possible for a bunch of "goat farmers" to execute such a plan. But if you actually look at those terrorists, many were educated and from well-to-do families.
- MiroF 7y ago
  Very much the same thing with the Sri Lanka attacks. I think the American public/media likes to paint everyone from the non-West as extremely backwards, when in reality I feel like everywhere in the non-West has "West"-like pockets of extreme affluence and then just huge amounts of inequality and rural poverty.
  - weberc2 7y ago
    Well, those events are anomalies. People usually are surprised by anomalies.
- droithomme 7y ago
  Yemenis defending their country are terrorists?
  - mhkool 7y ago
    Of course not, but since Saudi Arabia is the ally of the USA, in the eyes of many the enemy of Saudi Arabia must be a bunch of terrorists instead of liberation fighters who want to get rid of a president that was appointed by Saudi Arabia.

tastroder 7y ago

While I don't disagree, I was curious how sophisticated these are compared to, say, those American freedom dispensers. The embedded video is kind of interesting, the one showcased there towards the end looks like a slightly oversized model airplane painted in military gray.

avocado4 7y ago

Yemen is a really poor country, they don't have this capability. This is a proxy war, we had a lot of them in the past 100 years.

lacker 7y ago
Do they really not have this capability? You can buy a decent drone off the shelf for a thousand bucks, how hard is it to strap an IED on the back?
- bidatzi 7y ago
  With a range over 1000km?
  - iagovar 7y ago
    The drone doesn't need 1000km rage, you just need a pickup and a few people to get somewhat close.
  - hos234 7y ago
    How do they know how far the drone flew? Could be just Lawrence of Arabia on a camel crossing the desert and launching from outside the compound wall for all anyone knows.
    - bidatzi 7y ago
      Could be just that, but it doesn’t seem that’s what happened https://twitter.com/tobiaschneider/status/1172919700147396608?s=21 https://twitter.com/tobiaschneider/status/117291970014739660...
  - dragonwriter 7y ago
    The attack was, per their claim, carried out with assistance from inside Saudi Arabia. The required range is vastly smaller than 1000km.
chvid 7y ago

idoubtit 7y ago

The so-called "rebels" represent a large part of the Yemen population, and they ruled over their country for many month, so of course some of them are educated and have access to technical ressources. From memory, here's what happened in Yemen: 1. The Arab revolt of 2011 led to the fall of the long time dictator, Saleh. 2. In 2012, a conference in Ryad, organized by the powerful neighbor Saudi Arabia, appointed a new president Hadi. He was supposed to rule 1 year, until a democratic vote elects a new president. 3. In 2015, a large part of the population was fed up with the lack of change, especially with Hadi extending its reign. The Houthis, a religious minority from the North of Yemen, overtook the capital. Hadi resigned. 4. Six month later, Hadi went to Saudi Arabia. He claimed he was still president. SA and United Emirates invaded Yemen. Supporters of Saleh joined with Houthis against the invading troops and Hadi's supporters. 5. Yemen has fallen into occupation and civil war. People suffer from hunger and lack of medicine. Saudi bombings destroyed hospitals, factories, historic sites… According to the Guardian, at least 40% of Saudi bombings had purely civilians targets. Houthis have requested help from Iran, so the war is regional.

anigbrowl 7y ago
A succinct and fair summary.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

TaylorAlexander 7y ago

The term “rebel” is usually used to designate someone who isn’t on our side. There’s lots of smart people who aren’t on our side.

heartbreak 7y ago
American southerners endearingly refer to the Confederate States Army as the “rebels.” Star Wars makes a good fictional counterpoint as well.
- partialrecall 7y ago
  Perhaps also worth mentioning, some of the Russian Separatist forces in Donbass have adopted a flag that looks strikingly similar to CSA flag. It could be that they did this because they see themselves as rebels and therefore a famous rebel flag was fitting for them. When asked about it, they claim the similarity is coincidental. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Novorossiya#Similarity_with_%22Dixie_flag%22 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Novorossiya#Similarity...

rhegart 7y ago

Iran funds this. The advanced rockets by Hamas, the drones by the Houthi. Proxy war like usual. They are using Yemen for themselves uncaring of lives, we are killing so many innocent in Yemen. Life’s complicated but after the Iran deal, funding these groups by Iran increased significantly, and so did our subsequent killing of innocents.

mhkool 7y ago
I stated already in a previous comment: the Houthis are fighting for their own country. The Houthis may be helped by Iran but Iran is not commanding them. Since the Houthis fight for a Yemen without the appointed president, they fight for their own country. Saudi Arabia choose to have a war with the Houthis (not with Iran!) so this is not a proxy war at all.
AsyncAwait 7y ago
Iran! Of course let's mainly blame Iran, not KSA or the Western powers enabling them, this is an in depth analysis indeed.
caoilte 7y ago
Life is indeed complicated. What fueled Iran's involvement in Yemen was Saudia Arabia invading it. They worked very hard to keep the Houthis at arms length prior to that because as different religious sects go the only thing they really have in common is that the really nasty fundamentalist women-hating Sunni sects (ie the Saudis) hate them both for being different. And what kick started the war in Yemen? That would be a daddy's boy prince wanting to prove he could win his own war without daddy's help (that went well). None of which would happen if we didn't really enjoy selling guns to the Saudis, on account of all the money they've taken from us when they sold us oil. And we'd still be happily selling arms to the Iranian King we installed if they hadn't got sick of it and thrown us out. So this is on us. All of it.
- rhegart 7y ago
  Mostly agree, definitely agree that Iran meddling was 100% our fault.