6 ms·

Part of the magic of VR is the immersion. AR doesn't appeal to me, it seems more of a gimmick.

melling 7y ago
Except for the fact you spend most of your time in the real world. I can probably think of a million different uses for an AR display. What’s really missing is a good way to interact with that display. Voice recognition and hand gesture recognition need to improve.
- magashna 7y ago
  Yes, I spend most of my time in real life, which is why the modern equivalent of a pop-up book isn't that interesting to me. AR needs to have its "killer app" to draw me in. It's not there yet. Meanwhile, VR can take me to another world. Games like Thumper, Audioshield and Beat Saber are enough to sell me on a crazy musical experience.
  - jackbrookes 7y ago
    The cool thing about AR is you can think of any single app and it could be a killer app people would pay for. Imagine eye glasses that allowed you to just "zoom in" by clicking your fingers. Or glasses that seamlessly translate written text into your native language. Or highlighted the path you should take whilst walking to work using GPS navigation. Any of those alone would be compelling products, the cool thing is these are just possible "apps" for an AR device.
    - shkkmo 7y ago
      Once you reach an actual "eye glasses" form factor that is capable of general purpose use, a lot more things before viable. But the "killer apps" you mention are all just slightly more convenient versions of existing products (smart phones, binoculars) and are thus very dependent on a small enough form factor to realize that convenience. Not having to carry and pullout a laptop out to view live Google maps directions is a killer app. Not having to pull my phone out is a much smaller convenience. It only becomes a killer app when the convenience of wearing smart glasses surpasses that of having a smart phone in your pocket (which is a long way off). I do think there are killer apps that are in the nearer future. Anything where the rapidity of access to information conveys significant advantages is far less dependent of the form factor for success. You see this in the existing success of AR for business where those efficiencies can boost productivity.
wvenable 7y ago
When the resolution gets high enough, AR could eventually replace every screen (phone, TV, computer).
- cooljacob204 7y ago
  Will still need gesture and voice recognition to be on a reliable level. Also how would I text privately with someone? One theory I have is that we will eventually just carry around phone like slates which AR would display normal phone stuff on.
  - wvenable 7y ago
    I imagine you could just carry around a little keyboard or simply type into any flat surface just as you do now with a phone screen.
    - magashna 7y ago
      Without tactile feedback the hologram keyboards you see in sci-fi movies will feel terrible to use.
      - mustacheemperor 7y ago
        I remember when the industry spent 6 years sweating over how to make real buttons emerge from the smartphone display because tapping on a flat glass screen wasn't tactile enough. Eventually someone turned that into a new, faster means of input - swipe style keyboards. Maybe we'll see something similar with AR.
      - wvenable 7y ago
        Without tactile feedback is how the majority of people type out text messages. In my opinion it's actually easier to type on a phone screen than a tiny smartphone keyboard (of which I had many). But I agree. I never said AR would replace keyboards -- just screens.
superfrank 7y ago
Personally, I feel the exact opposite. I don't see VR providing a whole lot outside the area of entertainment. How often do you want to be completely removed from the physical world on a regular basis. Even when you do want immersion a good story or a game with good mechanics is far more important in entertainment than the medium it's delivered though. This is the reason people still read books, why retro video games are still played, and why 3D continually fails. A high tech medium, doesn't improve bad entertainment, but great entertainment can be delivered though a low tech medium. I'm not saying VR has no value, but I don't see it being some giant revolution. On the flip side, AR doesn't provide immersion, but rather enhances the world around you. AR allows pretty much any information you get from your phone or computer currently to be instantly hands free and always available. If I told you I had a pill that allowed you to remember 20% more than you currently do, I can't think of many industries that wouldn't be improved by giving that to every employee. Once headsets become light enough and cheap enough, that's what AR provides. Instant access to relevant information without diverting focus. VR seems to me like an extension of 3D technology, AR seems like an extension of the smartphone.
- azinman2 7y ago
  If you have to read something, then your focus most certainly will be diverted, even if it’s relevant to what you were looking at or thinking about. There in lies the problem — if information pops up that’s relevant to our conversation, you’re still getting pulled out of the moment in an asymmetric way. That has negative consequences to human interaction. Plus don’t forget — popping up the right information at the right time is an extraordinarily hard problem to solve.
  - superfrank 7y ago
    > if information pops up that’s relevant to our conversation, you’re still getting pulled out of the moment in an asymmetric way. I agree with you there, but I'd argue it's less distracting than trying to pull something not readily available from memory. Sure having to read something is distracting for a second, but it's far less distracting that trying to remember something that's just on the tip of your tongue, or having to pull out your phone. > popping up the right information at the right time is an extraordinarily hard problem to solve. It is for a generic solution, but I feel like custom built solutions will be what really revolutionizes the work place. If I'm a UPS driver, I can have a custom UPS app that allows me to look into my truck and instantly see the package id of each box overlaid on the box. That's not a hard problem to solve with the proper AR tools and it instantly provides value.
azinman2 7y ago
I’d argue the opposite is true. Yes immersion is fun/cool... briefly. I liken VR to a rollercoaster — it’s very fun but very intense, and therefore I don’t want it everyday. Maybe once a year or so is enough. Also don’t forget that a significant portion of the population will experience motion sickness, and there’s nothing you can do to prevent that (there are many techniques that have successfully minimized it, but there still remains a portion of the population that cannot handle it, period.) AR promises to be much more of a light touch in mixing digital content with the physical. You’re still grounded in reality so the motion sickness goes away (but if not well calibrated/tracked and is overused can still be annoying). That said, the total number of applications where this is desirable is way less than predicted by those who want a big new product category. You’re still wearing a screen on your face, in a world that’s largely starting to rebel against screen culture. Everyday use has a lot of problems in terms of attention management, leading to dystopia if not done correctly. There are targeted everyday applications that can be useful, although many are hard to justify over the cheaper 2D screen you already have in your pocket and certainly won’t get rid of simply because of both keyboard and the cognitively grounded value of direct manipulation.

Except for the fact you spend most of your time in the real world. I can probably think of a million different uses for an AR display. What’s really missing is a good way to interact with that display. Voice recognition and hand gesture recognition need to improve.

magashna 7y ago
Yes, I spend most of my time in real life, which is why the modern equivalent of a pop-up book isn't that interesting to me. AR needs to have its "killer app" to draw me in. It's not there yet. Meanwhile, VR can take me to another world. Games like Thumper, Audioshield and Beat Saber are enough to sell me on a crazy musical experience.
- jackbrookes 7y ago
  The cool thing about AR is you can think of any single app and it could be a killer app people would pay for. Imagine eye glasses that allowed you to just "zoom in" by clicking your fingers. Or glasses that seamlessly translate written text into your native language. Or highlighted the path you should take whilst walking to work using GPS navigation. Any of those alone would be compelling products, the cool thing is these are just possible "apps" for an AR device.
  - shkkmo 7y ago
    Once you reach an actual "eye glasses" form factor that is capable of general purpose use, a lot more things before viable. But the "killer apps" you mention are all just slightly more convenient versions of existing products (smart phones, binoculars) and are thus very dependent on a small enough form factor to realize that convenience. Not having to carry and pullout a laptop out to view live Google maps directions is a killer app. Not having to pull my phone out is a much smaller convenience. It only becomes a killer app when the convenience of wearing smart glasses surpasses that of having a smart phone in your pocket (which is a long way off). I do think there are killer apps that are in the nearer future. Anything where the rapidity of access to information conveys significant advantages is far less dependent of the form factor for success. You see this in the existing success of AR for business where those efficiencies can boost productivity.

wvenable 7y ago

When the resolution gets high enough, AR could eventually replace every screen (phone, TV, computer).

cooljacob204 7y ago
Will still need gesture and voice recognition to be on a reliable level. Also how would I text privately with someone? One theory I have is that we will eventually just carry around phone like slates which AR would display normal phone stuff on.
- wvenable 7y ago
  I imagine you could just carry around a little keyboard or simply type into any flat surface just as you do now with a phone screen.
  - magashna 7y ago
    Without tactile feedback the hologram keyboards you see in sci-fi movies will feel terrible to use.
    - mustacheemperor 7y ago
      I remember when the industry spent 6 years sweating over how to make real buttons emerge from the smartphone display because tapping on a flat glass screen wasn't tactile enough. Eventually someone turned that into a new, faster means of input - swipe style keyboards. Maybe we'll see something similar with AR.
    - wvenable 7y ago
      Without tactile feedback is how the majority of people type out text messages. In my opinion it's actually easier to type on a phone screen than a tiny smartphone keyboard (of which I had many). But I agree. I never said AR would replace keyboards -- just screens.

superfrank 7y ago

Personally, I feel the exact opposite. I don't see VR providing a whole lot outside the area of entertainment. How often do you want to be completely removed from the physical world on a regular basis. Even when you do want immersion a good story or a game with good mechanics is far more important in entertainment than the medium it's delivered though. This is the reason people still read books, why retro video games are still played, and why 3D continually fails. A high tech medium, doesn't improve bad entertainment, but great entertainment can be delivered though a low tech medium. I'm not saying VR has no value, but I don't see it being some giant revolution. On the flip side, AR doesn't provide immersion, but rather enhances the world around you. AR allows pretty much any information you get from your phone or computer currently to be instantly hands free and always available. If I told you I had a pill that allowed you to remember 20% more than you currently do, I can't think of many industries that wouldn't be improved by giving that to every employee. Once headsets become light enough and cheap enough, that's what AR provides. Instant access to relevant information without diverting focus. VR seems to me like an extension of 3D technology, AR seems like an extension of the smartphone.

azinman2 7y ago
If you have to read something, then your focus most certainly will be diverted, even if it’s relevant to what you were looking at or thinking about. There in lies the problem — if information pops up that’s relevant to our conversation, you’re still getting pulled out of the moment in an asymmetric way. That has negative consequences to human interaction. Plus don’t forget — popping up the right information at the right time is an extraordinarily hard problem to solve.
- superfrank 7y ago
  > if information pops up that’s relevant to our conversation, you’re still getting pulled out of the moment in an asymmetric way. I agree with you there, but I'd argue it's less distracting than trying to pull something not readily available from memory. Sure having to read something is distracting for a second, but it's far less distracting that trying to remember something that's just on the tip of your tongue, or having to pull out your phone. > popping up the right information at the right time is an extraordinarily hard problem to solve. It is for a generic solution, but I feel like custom built solutions will be what really revolutionizes the work place. If I'm a UPS driver, I can have a custom UPS app that allows me to look into my truck and instantly see the package id of each box overlaid on the box. That's not a hard problem to solve with the proper AR tools and it instantly provides value.

azinman2 7y ago

I’d argue the opposite is true. Yes immersion is fun/cool... briefly. I liken VR to a rollercoaster — it’s very fun but very intense, and therefore I don’t want it everyday. Maybe once a year or so is enough. Also don’t forget that a significant portion of the population will experience motion sickness, and there’s nothing you can do to prevent that (there are many techniques that have successfully minimized it, but there still remains a portion of the population that cannot handle it, period.) AR promises to be much more of a light touch in mixing digital content with the physical. You’re still grounded in reality so the motion sickness goes away (but if not well calibrated/tracked and is overused can still be annoying). That said, the total number of applications where this is desirable is way less than predicted by those who want a big new product category. You’re still wearing a screen on your face, in a world that’s largely starting to rebel against screen culture. Everyday use has a lot of problems in terms of attention management, leading to dystopia if not done correctly. There are targeted everyday applications that can be useful, although many are hard to justify over the cheaper 2D screen you already have in your pocket and certainly won’t get rid of simply because of both keyboard and the cognitively grounded value of direct manipulation.