4 ms·

Fixed. It now reads: "We may disclose personal information to: third parties, including agents or sub-contractors, who assist us in sending direct marketing ab

Fixed. It now reads: "We may disclose personal information to: third parties, including agents or sub-contractors, who assist us in sending direct marketing about our new products and features" What I meant about legal expertise is that we don't want to be in violation of our privacy policy if we decide to use tools to understand our users better, or if we decide to email users about new products and features. Which is why I left some room in the privacy policy to enable such features.

frequentnapper 7y ago
still leaves wiggle room. Suppose a "direct marketing sub-agent" opens up shop, helps you send a couple of emails, so technically they are assisting you in sending direct marketing, but then that allows you to maybe sell all of your users' personal info to that third party who just set up shop out of a vacuum. Even if you have good intentions and don't sell them the information, what's the guarantee that these third parties won't use the information you provided them for personal gain anyway?
- danfang 7y ago
  Two things. 1. We'll be transparent about the services that we use. That way you'll know who your data is being shared to, and what data will be shared. 2. We'll try to take an Apple-like approach of anonymizing data as much as possible and only sharing the few pieces of information we need to deliver a better product. I'm sorry there's no fool-proof way to guarantee perfect data privacy - at some point you'll have to trust us to do the right thing with your data. We hope that our incentives will . be aligned. Our service is predicated on keeping your information private and that's what you'll be paying for.
cmroanirgo 7y ago
> We may disclose personal information This alone will be enough of a deal breaker for privacy nuts, such as myself. If I'm going to use your service, you just champion privacy. This means no marketing gimmicks. Sorry. For me this comes no way close to being an iMessage alternative. Even if you become a privacy champion, you still need to expect us to trust your servers, which is a tricky thing without end to end encryption. Maybe an alternate model is to get funding from big corporate sponsorship and have a distributed network that could be hosted on our own droplets (using open source, of course). You can then have a paid hosted saas for those not technically ready to self host. Until there's a solution out there that does just that, I'm very unlikely to bite.
- danfang 7y ago
  Yeah - I don't see Thread as the right product for privacy nuts, as you refer to yourself. There are better services for that, like Signal. I imagine Thread as a company that focuses more on delivering products that allow people to build more meaningful relationships and connections in a way that benefits their long term mental/social health. I believe we can do that in a way that delivers an 80/20 on privacy too, by not using targeted advertising, and having 0 incentives to sell your data. If you're not willing to trust our servers, I don't think the product is right for you. Hopefully we build trust as a company that does right by our users in the long run, unlike what I'm seeing from companies today.
drusepth 7y ago
I'm definitely not your target audience here so please take this with a grain of salt (as I might misunderstand what people value about privacy), but isn't "using tools to understand our users better" exactly what privacy-first people _don't_ want? Gathering that kind of metadata about what users on the platform are doing, instead of making it end-to-end encrypted so you (as the provider) can't see into what people are doing?

frequentnapper 7y ago

still leaves wiggle room. Suppose a "direct marketing sub-agent" opens up shop, helps you send a couple of emails, so technically they are assisting you in sending direct marketing, but then that allows you to maybe sell all of your users' personal info to that third party who just set up shop out of a vacuum. Even if you have good intentions and don't sell them the information, what's the guarantee that these third parties won't use the information you provided them for personal gain anyway?

danfang 7y ago
Two things. 1. We'll be transparent about the services that we use. That way you'll know who your data is being shared to, and what data will be shared. 2. We'll try to take an Apple-like approach of anonymizing data as much as possible and only sharing the few pieces of information we need to deliver a better product. I'm sorry there's no fool-proof way to guarantee perfect data privacy - at some point you'll have to trust us to do the right thing with your data. We hope that our incentives will . be aligned. Our service is predicated on keeping your information private and that's what you'll be paying for.

cmroanirgo 7y ago

> We may disclose personal information This alone will be enough of a deal breaker for privacy nuts, such as myself. If I'm going to use your service, you just champion privacy. This means no marketing gimmicks. Sorry. For me this comes no way close to being an iMessage alternative. Even if you become a privacy champion, you still need to expect us to trust your servers, which is a tricky thing without end to end encryption. Maybe an alternate model is to get funding from big corporate sponsorship and have a distributed network that could be hosted on our own droplets (using open source, of course). You can then have a paid hosted saas for those not technically ready to self host. Until there's a solution out there that does just that, I'm very unlikely to bite.

danfang 7y ago
Yeah - I don't see Thread as the right product for privacy nuts, as you refer to yourself. There are better services for that, like Signal. I imagine Thread as a company that focuses more on delivering products that allow people to build more meaningful relationships and connections in a way that benefits their long term mental/social health. I believe we can do that in a way that delivers an 80/20 on privacy too, by not using targeted advertising, and having 0 incentives to sell your data. If you're not willing to trust our servers, I don't think the product is right for you. Hopefully we build trust as a company that does right by our users in the long run, unlike what I'm seeing from companies today.

drusepth 7y ago

I'm definitely not your target audience here so please take this with a grain of salt (as I might misunderstand what people value about privacy), but isn't "using tools to understand our users better" exactly what privacy-first people _don't_ want? Gathering that kind of metadata about what users on the platform are doing, instead of making it end-to-end encrypted so you (as the provider) can't see into what people are doing?