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Yeah but we're not discussing those other issues. We're specifically discussing using technology to enforce borders. If you want to make immigration to the US

Yeah but we're not discussing those other issues. We're specifically discussing using technology to enforce borders. If you want to make immigration to the US completely legal and unfettered that's a different conversation.

nemothekid 7y ago
>Yeah but we're not discussing those other issues. We're specifically discussing using technology to enforce borders. You can't remove Anduril from the cultural context it was born in. Handwaving away his entire post "because we are not discussing those other issues" is a cheap cop-out. Its akin to saying Facebook shouldn't have an instropective look at the way it collects data because "elections are other unrelated issues." We agree that sovereign nations should be allowed to enforce its borders. But for what reason should technology like Anduril be funded and exist? It's more likely this technology is used in an Orwellian manner than in whatever noble "enforcing borders" principle you believe in.
csb6 7y ago
I did not say I want illegal immigration to be legal. I agree with nemothekid’s other reply. As I said earlier, nothing exists in a vacuum. I am arguing that the U.S. government’s immigration enforcement apparatus is consistently unjust. Saying, “Oh but that’s not what we’re talking about” saddens me. That is exactly what we are talking about, only looking ahead at a new way for injustice to occur. It is absolutely reasonable for you and I to consider who the people are who will be using this privacy-invasive technology. Increasingly, I am disappointed by the tech world’s lack of ethical awareness and foresight for these kinds of issues. The outcome won’t be “border += cool new virtual fence”. It will be “border += virtual fence” plus the bad side effects that come from making immigration enforcement more powerful, as I argued above. On the other hand, maybe all that ethical stuff is just B.S. and all actions should be taken without thinking of consequences or context. Indeed, the world is a bit like Haskell - all pure and no side effects! Just a promising startup with some kick-ass tech ready to disrupt shit!

nemothekid 7y ago

>Yeah but we're not discussing those other issues. We're specifically discussing using technology to enforce borders. You can't remove Anduril from the cultural context it was born in. Handwaving away his entire post "because we are not discussing those other issues" is a cheap cop-out. Its akin to saying Facebook shouldn't have an instropective look at the way it collects data because "elections are other unrelated issues." We agree that sovereign nations should be allowed to enforce its borders. But for what reason should technology like Anduril be funded and exist? It's more likely this technology is used in an Orwellian manner than in whatever noble "enforcing borders" principle you believe in.

csb6 7y ago

I did not say I want illegal immigration to be legal. I agree with nemothekid’s other reply. As I said earlier, nothing exists in a vacuum. I am arguing that the U.S. government’s immigration enforcement apparatus is consistently unjust. Saying, “Oh but that’s not what we’re talking about” saddens me. That is exactly what we are talking about, only looking ahead at a new way for injustice to occur. It is absolutely reasonable for you and I to consider who the people are who will be using this privacy-invasive technology. Increasingly, I am disappointed by the tech world’s lack of ethical awareness and foresight for these kinds of issues. The outcome won’t be “border += cool new virtual fence”. It will be “border += virtual fence” plus the bad side effects that come from making immigration enforcement more powerful, as I argued above. On the other hand, maybe all that ethical stuff is just B.S. and all actions should be taken without thinking of consequences or context. Indeed, the world is a bit like Haskell - all pure and no side effects! Just a promising startup with some kick-ass tech ready to disrupt shit!