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> I hate the mild feeling of discomfort I get when I tell most people I'm a software engineer. Most software engineers have a healthy circle of friends and soc

> I hate the mild feeling of discomfort I get when I tell most people I'm a software engineer. Most software engineers have a healthy circle of friends and social life. > I hate having eclectic or traditional "nerdy" interests and getting a similar reaction. It's not any different when an electrician, lawyer or a doctor wants to talk shop. Most people you will interact with don't have the same interests as you. > I have no interest in turning off that part of my brain so I can fit into the sportsfan stereotype Virtually no one fits cleanly into stereotypes. Stereotypes are useful for generalizing groups, not individuals. "Sportsfanning" is highly correlated with a rich social life, but you are confusing cause and effect. > That I have nothing to look forward to but more of the same of this, and the few people I have contact with disappear in one way or the other. Sometimes I ask, why bother? All of the rationalization about software engineering, "nerdy" interests is leading you astray. None of those are barriers to a fulfilling social life. Your social life issues are due to any number of problems. It could be depression, anxiety, it could be poor social skills. It is possible (maybe less likely) that you have little interest in deep social connections, but you have to evaluate carefully whether you are really unhappy with just a small online circle, or are you just worried because you appear away from the norm. In any event I encourage you to think deeply about your situation. If you want to change anything, quitting software engineering won't help. It will most likely require a great deal of struggle. Depression and anxiety are not easily shaken off. Learning social skills like most things is harder later in life. I can assure you people in your position have improved, but only after taking stock of what is holding them back and seeking appropriate assistance.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
Jenz 7y ago
> it could be poor social skills. Is this an area where you can improve? My social skills are abyssmally non-existant... I am in a suprisingly similar situation to satokemas, all but the fact that I do not ever doubt "why bother" (I love the world) and I go to high school— I don’t work, that is. I’ve been alone for two years in school now, although I just recently got one friend that is very understanding, though I guess I’ll still be alone almost all the time, this last year of school. This is sad, I don’t like things being sad. Therefore I want to do something about it...
- condercet 7y ago
  Social skills are skills that can be improved upon like any other. A good place to start would be seeing if there are improv classes near you.
- slothtrop 7y ago
  > Is this an area where you can improve? Yes. As with everything else it just gets easier the more you do it. We feel at our most socially awkward in high school I think, in part because we're unfairly hard on ourselves. People are way more forgiving of social awkwardness than we think, stumbling is not the end of the world. For instance, how would you react if someone was socially awkward around you? Exactly. Relax, have fun, sleep well. You don't have to be a talkative extrovert to be liked; I'm an introvert and never chat anyone's ear off except with things I can geek out over (music, games). You grow confidence as you engage more, but to get to that point you have to break out of your shell somewhat. A medium always helped to relate to others in my case, be it sports, music or gaming.
- p1esk 7y ago
  My social skills are abyssmally non-existant I think you mean something else, because you're here, publicly expressing your thoughts, pretty well I might add, and you've already engaged a few people in a conversation. I'm pretty sure your school has people you can socialize with, but you probably just don't want to socialize with them. Maybe it's because you don't find those people attractive or interesting, just like some other people in your school don't find you interesting or attractive. That's normal.
- tempestn 7y ago
  In addition to the other things mentioned, I'll just add that once you graduate you'll have a whole new environment with new opportunities to make friends. In particular, if you go to college I would recommend living on campus: dorm housing tends to often be a built-in group of friends. (And if you don't like the crowd you end up with, you can always move for the next semester.) More generally though, you're still young and have lots of new opportunities to make friends ahead of you. So while I definitely agree with some of the other replies, if you find yourself struggling still, just remember high school isn't forever and there will be new opportunities in the future; you just have to be ready to take full advantage of them.
jayshua 7y ago
To add to this comment, if you find you do in fact want to make a change, one way to help accomplish that change is through the Future Authoring Program [1]. It's basically a writing exercise where you write out what your life will be like in a few years if you make all of the changes you are thinking about. Then you write out what your life will be like if you don't make any changes at all. After that you have something to work toward and something to run away from. Depending on the person it can be a huge help. [1] https://selfauthoring.com/future-authoring https://selfauthoring.com/future-authoring
- nwalker85 7y ago
  I cannot recommend the selfauthoring program enough.
- derg 7y ago
  Woah. I've been feeling very anxious and stressed out about the present and my future and feeling incredibly aimless. This seems incredibly like what I need (more structure) and a better outline. Thanks!
enraged_camel 7y ago
>>Most software engineers have a healthy circle of friends and social life. Sorry, but I'm going to call [citation needed] on this. It's a rather extraordinary claim, and goes against both popular stereotypes and my personal experience.
- teppifk 7y ago
  This is confirmation bias. I don't think the stereotypes are as generally popular as you claim. My own observational bias is the countless "learn to code", "anyone can code" promotions targeted at youth that make no mention of social limitations. Depression and anxiety are common in the general population. Social maladaptation is also common, though less so. It is unsurprisingly true that these traits are a bit overrepresented in the tech professions. But tech is not unique in this, the healthcare professions also overrepresent depression, for instance. In either case, it is not even close to a majority. People that tend to be in these minority groups though by very nature isolate themselves and tend to only see that minority. At worst, online these can lead to some very troublesome echo chambers.
  - enraged_camel 7y ago
    >>This is confirmation bias. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. But you made the original claim, therefore the burden is on you to provide supporting evidence.
    - teppifk 7y ago
      > But you made the original claim, therefore the burden is on you to provide supporting evidence. Not really. This is not some magical incantation that compels me to do anything, nor does it make what I said wrong. And tip if you want to win at online forum logic argument wankery (not with me though), perhaps appeals to "stereotypes" and "personal experience" are not the best place to start.
      - hamiltonc 7y ago
        Translation: I don't have any.
weare138 7y ago
> Most software engineers have a healthy circle of friends and social life. I understand the point you're trying to make but this isn't a truism. It's a subjective opinion that wouldn't apply to any industry much less tech, which itself isn't specific to software engineering. This is an issue that effects all specialized fields of study, interests and careers. I don't feel generalizing the issue in a blanket statement that the problem is specific to the individual in question and somehow not related to circumstances beyond that individual's control is beneficial to the OP and anyone dealing with similar issues. How many people can astronauts have honest conversations with about traveling in space that other people would understand and empathize with? Obviously very few, but it would be inaccurate and irresponsible to lay blame on an astronaut if they feel socially isolated as a result. Later in your post you use a loaded, weasel worded statement that I strongly disagree with, which again seems to again lay blame on the OP for their honest and earnest concern: "It could be depression, anxiety, it could be poor social skills. It is possible (maybe less likely) that you have little interest in deep social connections" It "could" be any number of things but only one perspective is being addressed. Implying that someone's failure to conform to our ever changing, opinionated and perceived social "norm" is the cause of their issues and concerns is not helping anyone.
- teppifk 7y ago
  > It "could" be any number of things but only one perspective is being addressed. Implying that someone's failure to conform to our ever changing, opinionated and perceived social "norm" is the cause of their issues and concerns is not helping anyone. Uhh.. no I mentioned: "It is possible (maybe less likely) that you have little interest in deep social connections." Listen bud, a person that is well-adjusted in their social life whether that is gregarious or solitude doesn't post a complaint of this nature to an online forum. Something is wrong, whether it is the way the individual attempts to make social connections or their own acceptance of their needs and letting go of perceptions of what people think. And not all of that can be blamed on others. I didn't claim to know or judge which one it was. And yes, most software engineers have a healthy social life, because software engineers as a population are not really that different from the norm. > I don't feel generalizing the issue in a blanket statement that the problem is specific to the individual in question and somehow not related to circumstances beyond that individual's control is beneficial to the OP and anyone dealing with similar issues. Problems that are beyond an individual's control are worth acknowledging but are otherwise irrelevant since there is nothing that can be done about them. Identifying problems that are within one's control are the first and only step to improving one's circumstances. There were plenty of people here replying that: oh it's just other people, it's not you. Well that is partly true, but that's also bullshit and not helpful. I refuse to believe that someone complaining on an Internet forum about their social problems has exhausted all options for personal growth. > Obviously very few, but it would be inaccurate and irresponsible to lay blame on an astronaut if they feel socially isolated as a result. No, I say it is fully responsible to blame (I hate this word, but I'm trying not to be weasley) the astronaut if they feel socially isolated. Ultimately the only one responsible for their happiness and fulfillment is them alone. Sure they can blame the plebes that don't "get it" and wallow in permanent victimhood, but that doesn't do any favors for their psyche. A lot of people, including astronauts are able to find joy in other things than space travel that they can then relate with a broader array of people (this may be "pedestrian" sports, or this may more like joining the demoscene for the Atari 2600). The thing that you and others seem to miss is that efforted development of broader interests can be an ends justifying means to counter social isolation. It's a responsible and mature thing to do.
slothtrop 7y ago
Agreed, and would add that latching too much to some idea of a categorized identity can be a crutch. Half of life is showing up, as the saying goes: if you're lonely, you have to get out there. I moved to a new city and joined meetup clubs, played pick up sports, etc. You have to move outside your comfort zone sometimes, there's no way around it; no one's going to swoop into solve this problem for you. Besides loneliness, sedentary lifestyle, poor diet and low vitamin D3 can lead to low serotonin levels and therefore moodiness and loss of ambition.
undulation 7y ago
>> I hate the mild feeling of discomfort I get when I tell most people I'm a software engineer. > Most software engineers have a healthy circle of friends and social life. Huh? OP's allusion to "mild-discomfort" when talking about their career field leads you to respond with the patronizing suggestion that "most software engineers have a healthy circle of friends"? That's an unhelpful and presumptuous piece of advice, especially considering it's directed to someone who is opening up about their current mental health issues
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- teppifk 7y ago
  Heh, well I read it through, and I totally see what you're saying. It comes across a bit thoughtless if read as a direct reply to the statement rather than as part of the larger post below (which is totally sensible to read it that way). Unfortunately I can't edit it now, but the intent was to make a point that even for a software engineer: depression, social anxiety and isolation, etc are not "normal" and one should not resign themselves to that view regardless of stereotypes or perceptions. That statement isn't that important, I should have omitted it.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

Jenz 7y ago

> it could be poor social skills. Is this an area where you can improve? My social skills are abyssmally non-existant... I am in a suprisingly similar situation to satokemas, all but the fact that I do not ever doubt "why bother" (I love the world) and I go to high school— I don’t work, that is. I’ve been alone for two years in school now, although I just recently got one friend that is very understanding, though I guess I’ll still be alone almost all the time, this last year of school. This is sad, I don’t like things being sad. Therefore I want to do something about it...

condercet 7y ago
Social skills are skills that can be improved upon like any other. A good place to start would be seeing if there are improv classes near you.
slothtrop 7y ago
> Is this an area where you can improve? Yes. As with everything else it just gets easier the more you do it. We feel at our most socially awkward in high school I think, in part because we're unfairly hard on ourselves. People are way more forgiving of social awkwardness than we think, stumbling is not the end of the world. For instance, how would you react if someone was socially awkward around you? Exactly. Relax, have fun, sleep well. You don't have to be a talkative extrovert to be liked; I'm an introvert and never chat anyone's ear off except with things I can geek out over (music, games). You grow confidence as you engage more, but to get to that point you have to break out of your shell somewhat. A medium always helped to relate to others in my case, be it sports, music or gaming.
p1esk 7y ago
My social skills are abyssmally non-existant I think you mean something else, because you're here, publicly expressing your thoughts, pretty well I might add, and you've already engaged a few people in a conversation. I'm pretty sure your school has people you can socialize with, but you probably just don't want to socialize with them. Maybe it's because you don't find those people attractive or interesting, just like some other people in your school don't find you interesting or attractive. That's normal.
tempestn 7y ago
In addition to the other things mentioned, I'll just add that once you graduate you'll have a whole new environment with new opportunities to make friends. In particular, if you go to college I would recommend living on campus: dorm housing tends to often be a built-in group of friends. (And if you don't like the crowd you end up with, you can always move for the next semester.) More generally though, you're still young and have lots of new opportunities to make friends ahead of you. So while I definitely agree with some of the other replies, if you find yourself struggling still, just remember high school isn't forever and there will be new opportunities in the future; you just have to be ready to take full advantage of them.

jayshua 7y ago

To add to this comment, if you find you do in fact want to make a change, one way to help accomplish that change is through the Future Authoring Program [1]. It's basically a writing exercise where you write out what your life will be like in a few years if you make all of the changes you are thinking about. Then you write out what your life will be like if you don't make any changes at all. After that you have something to work toward and something to run away from. Depending on the person it can be a huge help. [1] https://selfauthoring.com/future-authoring https://selfauthoring.com/future-authoring

nwalker85 7y ago
I cannot recommend the selfauthoring program enough.
derg 7y ago
Woah. I've been feeling very anxious and stressed out about the present and my future and feeling incredibly aimless. This seems incredibly like what I need (more structure) and a better outline. Thanks!

enraged_camel 7y ago

>>Most software engineers have a healthy circle of friends and social life. Sorry, but I'm going to call [citation needed] on this. It's a rather extraordinary claim, and goes against both popular stereotypes and my personal experience.

teppifk 7y ago
This is confirmation bias. I don't think the stereotypes are as generally popular as you claim. My own observational bias is the countless "learn to code", "anyone can code" promotions targeted at youth that make no mention of social limitations. Depression and anxiety are common in the general population. Social maladaptation is also common, though less so. It is unsurprisingly true that these traits are a bit overrepresented in the tech professions. But tech is not unique in this, the healthcare professions also overrepresent depression, for instance. In either case, it is not even close to a majority. People that tend to be in these minority groups though by very nature isolate themselves and tend to only see that minority. At worst, online these can lead to some very troublesome echo chambers.
- enraged_camel 7y ago
  >>This is confirmation bias. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. But you made the original claim, therefore the burden is on you to provide supporting evidence.
  - teppifk 7y ago
    > But you made the original claim, therefore the burden is on you to provide supporting evidence. Not really. This is not some magical incantation that compels me to do anything, nor does it make what I said wrong. And tip if you want to win at online forum logic argument wankery (not with me though), perhaps appeals to "stereotypes" and "personal experience" are not the best place to start.
    - hamiltonc 7y ago
      Translation: I don't have any.

weare138 7y ago

> Most software engineers have a healthy circle of friends and social life. I understand the point you're trying to make but this isn't a truism. It's a subjective opinion that wouldn't apply to any industry much less tech, which itself isn't specific to software engineering. This is an issue that effects all specialized fields of study, interests and careers. I don't feel generalizing the issue in a blanket statement that the problem is specific to the individual in question and somehow not related to circumstances beyond that individual's control is beneficial to the OP and anyone dealing with similar issues. How many people can astronauts have honest conversations with about traveling in space that other people would understand and empathize with? Obviously very few, but it would be inaccurate and irresponsible to lay blame on an astronaut if they feel socially isolated as a result. Later in your post you use a loaded, weasel worded statement that I strongly disagree with, which again seems to again lay blame on the OP for their honest and earnest concern: "It could be depression, anxiety, it could be poor social skills. It is possible (maybe less likely) that you have little interest in deep social connections" It "could" be any number of things but only one perspective is being addressed. Implying that someone's failure to conform to our ever changing, opinionated and perceived social "norm" is the cause of their issues and concerns is not helping anyone.

teppifk 7y ago
> It "could" be any number of things but only one perspective is being addressed. Implying that someone's failure to conform to our ever changing, opinionated and perceived social "norm" is the cause of their issues and concerns is not helping anyone. Uhh.. no I mentioned: "It is possible (maybe less likely) that you have little interest in deep social connections." Listen bud, a person that is well-adjusted in their social life whether that is gregarious or solitude doesn't post a complaint of this nature to an online forum. Something is wrong, whether it is the way the individual attempts to make social connections or their own acceptance of their needs and letting go of perceptions of what people think. And not all of that can be blamed on others. I didn't claim to know or judge which one it was. And yes, most software engineers have a healthy social life, because software engineers as a population are not really that different from the norm. > I don't feel generalizing the issue in a blanket statement that the problem is specific to the individual in question and somehow not related to circumstances beyond that individual's control is beneficial to the OP and anyone dealing with similar issues. Problems that are beyond an individual's control are worth acknowledging but are otherwise irrelevant since there is nothing that can be done about them. Identifying problems that are within one's control are the first and only step to improving one's circumstances. There were plenty of people here replying that: oh it's just other people, it's not you. Well that is partly true, but that's also bullshit and not helpful. I refuse to believe that someone complaining on an Internet forum about their social problems has exhausted all options for personal growth. > Obviously very few, but it would be inaccurate and irresponsible to lay blame on an astronaut if they feel socially isolated as a result. No, I say it is fully responsible to blame (I hate this word, but I'm trying not to be weasley) the astronaut if they feel socially isolated. Ultimately the only one responsible for their happiness and fulfillment is them alone. Sure they can blame the plebes that don't "get it" and wallow in permanent victimhood, but that doesn't do any favors for their psyche. A lot of people, including astronauts are able to find joy in other things than space travel that they can then relate with a broader array of people (this may be "pedestrian" sports, or this may more like joining the demoscene for the Atari 2600). The thing that you and others seem to miss is that efforted development of broader interests can be an ends justifying means to counter social isolation. It's a responsible and mature thing to do.

slothtrop 7y ago

Agreed, and would add that latching too much to some idea of a categorized identity can be a crutch. Half of life is showing up, as the saying goes: if you're lonely, you have to get out there. I moved to a new city and joined meetup clubs, played pick up sports, etc. You have to move outside your comfort zone sometimes, there's no way around it; no one's going to swoop into solve this problem for you. Besides loneliness, sedentary lifestyle, poor diet and low vitamin D3 can lead to low serotonin levels and therefore moodiness and loss of ambition.

undulation 7y ago

>> I hate the mild feeling of discomfort I get when I tell most people I'm a software engineer. > Most software engineers have a healthy circle of friends and social life. Huh? OP's allusion to "mild-discomfort" when talking about their career field leads you to respond with the patronizing suggestion that "most software engineers have a healthy circle of friends"? That's an unhelpful and presumptuous piece of advice, especially considering it's directed to someone who is opening up about their current mental health issues

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
teppifk 7y ago
Heh, well I read it through, and I totally see what you're saying. It comes across a bit thoughtless if read as a direct reply to the statement rather than as part of the larger post below (which is totally sensible to read it that way). Unfortunately I can't edit it now, but the intent was to make a point that even for a software engineer: depression, social anxiety and isolation, etc are not "normal" and one should not resign themselves to that view regardless of stereotypes or perceptions. That statement isn't that important, I should have omitted it.